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The D Legacy

Are weight crates a scam??

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i just found this info on other post in the forum:

"If you place the full amount of containers available you get a 40% reduction in speed from what I understand, and that's before anything is in them.  Then you have the normal weight penalties that start kicking in."

Assuming full following wind;
0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 18.4 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 6.6 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 14.7 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 8.8 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 5.3 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 6.6 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 4.0 knots

based on this info i did some math and if this numbers are correct and by simply adding the crates you lose 40% speed then thats quite similar to losing 45% of your original weight

0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 18.4 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots <-----

losing 40% speed is the same as going from 30% weight to 75%

0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, six crates: 11.04 knots <-----

since each crate transforms 2 000 kg into 200 kg we are talking about 12 000 kg converted into 1 200 kg for a saved weight of 10 800 Kg in a newly build galleon with 30 000 Kg capacity sacrificing 45% means losing 13 500 Kg wich means you are losing more weight than you are actually saving, and if we consider a level 40 galleon fully focused in weight then losing 45% of 42 000 kg it means losing 18 900 Kg

if this numbers and the information are correct whats even the point of the crates??

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Posted (edited)

if you want to load the maximum possible weight without sinking, you put 6 containers on your ship. the trade off is that you will lose a lot of speed.

if you want the optimum distribution of weight and speed you only use 2 or 3 containers.

do the math. it adds up. using 2 containers filled to the brim will be faster than loading the same weight on a ship with 0 containers.

it will also be faster than using 6 containers on an empty ship.

there are more possible values to observe than just min and max.

more often than not, the optimum lies somewhere between.

also you shouldn't do comparisons based on % of weight.

rather do absolute amounts, like 10 tons.

Edited by user1

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Arrrr matey, who knew pirate’n be such a spreadsheet intensive endeavor? Lower the Jolly Roger and hoist the Excel logo ye scurvey dogs. Forget the sextant, someone bring me a bar graph or a pie chart. Never mind the Pirate code, do we follow FIFO or LIFO inventory accounting practices?

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10 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Arrrr matey, who knew pirate’n be such a spreadsheet intensive endeavor? Lower the Jolly Roger and hoist the Excel logo ye scurvey dogs. Forget the sextant, someone bring me a bar graph or a pie chart. Never mind the Pirate code, do we follow FIFO or LIFO inventory accounting practices?

 

You know even pirates always had/has that one guy lol

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2 minutes ago, crazywildfire said:

 

You know even pirates always had/has that one guy lol

Having never actually been a pirate I will have to take your word for it, but kidding aside I appreciate these guys trying to get to the bottom of the relevant math.

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7 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Having never actually been a pirate I will have to take your word for it, but kidding aside I appreciate these guys trying to get to the bottom of the relevant math.

Lol I guess. I was just sayin is all. I have no clue but I would imagine pirate or not you always have that one guy lol.

I'm glad as well. If the numbers are correct I agree why have it. If it is correct then I would imagine it will get worked on. I'm sure they don't want something taking up space when they could put something else in its spot. Doubt they would do it to this so that is why I feel they would make some adjustments somewhere. 

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Posted (edited)

Hey, pirates aint idiots 😛 I mean, They are rumored  the ones that started putting lime in their grog to prevent scurvy first.

*further thought! Maybe the OP is more of a Navy Man or Trader at heart, and you know they are all about those spreadsheet and numbers.

I had not bothered with more than 2 crates myself, I mean.. there is only soo much gathering to be done in a setting for me. I find this thread interesting.

Edited by Liatni

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Posted (edited)

Keep in mind,  Its not just the weight and carry amount it helps with.    It also help's with the ease of transferring your goods off your boat.    With correct ramp placement you can easily setup a  dock that will allow you to walk up to the crate and unload it, without having to keep getting your your tame on and off the boat to unload it from the Ship Res Box.

 

 

Edited by Dosgimp

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You have one mathematical assumption off in your math. Each crate converts 8,000 kg into 1,000 kg. You listed 2,000 to 200, so your numbers are off by a factor of 4.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Sleepinator2000 said:

You have one mathematical assumption off in your math. Each crate converts 8,000 kg into 1,000 kg. You listed 2,000 to 200, so your numbers are off by a factor of 4.

And not the right ratio. Since the first is 8:1 and the second 10:1

wait, wasn’t it 8k into 1600 kg?

Edited by boomervoncannon

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5 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

wait, wasn’t it 8k into 1600 kg?

You're right. it is 8k to 1.6k. Still the capacity is 4x what the OP is listing.

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12 hours ago, The D Legacy said:

i just found this info on other post in the forum:

"If you place the full amount of containers available you get a 40% reduction in speed from what I understand, and that's before anything is in them.  Then you have the normal weight penalties that start kicking in."

Assuming full following wind;
0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 18.4 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 6.6 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 14.7 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 8.8 knots
3 weight, 3 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 5.3 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 6.6 knots
6 weight, 0 speed, 75% capacity, six crates: 4.0 knots

based on this info i did some math and if this numbers are correct and by simply adding the crates you lose 40% speed then thats quite similar to losing 45% of your original weight

0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, no crates: 18.4 knots
0 weight, 6 speed, 75% capacity, no crates: 11.0 knots <-----

losing 40% speed is the same as going from 30% weight to 75%

0 weight, 6 speed, 30% capacity, six crates: 11.04 knots <-----

since each crate transforms 2 000 kg into 200 kg we are talking about 12 000 kg converted into 1 200 kg for a saved weight of 10 800 Kg in a newly build galleon with 30 000 Kg capacity sacrificing 45% means losing 13 500 Kg wich means you are losing more weight than you are actually saving, and if we consider a level 40 galleon fully focused in weight then losing 45% of 42 000 kg it means losing 18 900 Kg

if this numbers and the information are correct whats even the point of the crates??

Link this other post about ship speeds, its wrong or your leaving something relevant out. Each crate has a capacity of 8000kg that reduces the ship top speed by a fixed 6.7% (40/6) and a variable weight contribution up to 1600kg for a maximum weight crate. If you have 6 full crates that's 6x8000=48000kg of stuff you are carrying for a weight effect of 6x1600=9600kg. 10000kg (the original 30% weight) + 9600kg=19600kg or a little under 60% weight, not 75% in your example so your already going significantly faster. That's point one, point two is your 75% is actually only moving 75% of 30000kg = 22500-10000kg base weight = 12500kg moved while the crate solution moved a full 48000kg.

@Simonsays095 wrote some really good guides on this, start with this one

and then have a read on the others.

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So the smart thing to say would be "I loaded my ship until it was full and then put it in crates and it made no difference."

It makes a huge difference. If your expecting to fly around at high speed it aint happinin. If you want to carry say 80,000 lbs of total freight then yes.

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2 hours ago, boomervoncannon said:

Let’s all agree that the important thing here is that I shouldn’t have to do a lot of math. Math feels like work.

Ok, so here's a simple question for you: Is it faster to take the speed hit from full crates, or is it faster to make multiple trips?

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, 6Xero9 said:

Ok, so here's a simple question for you: Is it faster to take the speed hit from full crates, or is it faster to make multiple trips?

Yes.

 

 

 

 

pro tip: given the mat cost of the racks is marginal, if you are wearing the racks on the way there ur doin it rong.  Only take the penalty on the trip home, when you actually need the capacity.

Also since the racks can add 48k weight (galleon assumed) capacity for the same speed penalty as filling the ship to about 20k weight (referencing that per simonsays guide 60% of max speed occurs at about 2/3 max weight and also assuming default max of 30k for the galleon), it depends partly what your galleons weight is before cargo but it’s obvious that a ship without racks would need to make at least 3 trips to haul the same amount of cargo at the same speed. That’s a lot of assumptions but the core point is most of the time using racks is the way to go and this becomes more true the further you need to go.

Lastly I hate you because you just tricked me into doing math.

Edited by boomervoncannon
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Since a weight sail is 60% the speed of a speed sail and max cargo holds also slows you by 40% how about we make 1 weight sail negate 1 cargo hold. This will give slightly more movement speed with max cargo holds due to free weight addition to the ship and finally give weight sails a purpose while giving a decent cargo hauler ship build.

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It is pretty damn easy...:

- you build your ship to your liking, put everything when it is empty cargo (so crew, needed ammo, repair mats, etc) but your good to go.

- you check the current weight and check which ratio of speed to weight sails gives higher speed value. If you ships is to heavy for 6x Speed, exchange for a weight and be a little bit faster.

- after your ship is ready and you need to haul cargo you put in a rack at about 4000units of weight you want to carry. You will be faster than with the cargo not in racks.

- after you are done with the cargo you destroy the racks again

it is that easy and no racks should not make you magically faster... the just make you fast than without them...

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Having read some of that, thank the gods for stacking mods and the 90% weight reduction - it means I can carry what I want and don't have to do maths.  😄

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1 hour ago, Coggage said:

Having read some of that, thank the gods for stacking mods and the 90% weight reduction - it means I can carry what I want and don't have to do maths.  😄

Hey!

 

 

 

 

 

 

shut up.

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Posted (edited)

Lol this Post has made me google this since, mid 1600 to mid 1700's (the golden age of piracy) seems to be a thing here in Atlas.

How Fast Did Ships Travel in the 1700s?

The speed of ships in the 1700s depended on the wind, but averaged about 4 to 5 knots, with the ability to reach 20 knots. In its life of 8 to 10 years, a ship would typically embark on four or five voyages.

So, your fully loaded CARGO sailed ship is actually pretty fast even at 11, after..erm.. all! heh heh 😛

Anyone remember and if you were around its only been a handful of months now when, A ship in Atlas wouldn't budge if It was against the wind,  at all?

Edited by Liatni

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22 hours ago, boomervoncannon said:

Lastly I hate you because you just tricked me into doing math.

I mean, the math is simple if you really think about it.

A-B(time*2 for simple math as half speed is easier to account for) Vs. A-B, B-A, A-B.

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Lemme splain somefin to joo essay.

I was a marketing major. Dat’s the business degree joo get if you wanna make the monies but you don’t wanna have to do no maths eh?

When joo start cranking on the maths, it make my head hurt essay. It make me wanna crank on you with a shank til your insides spill out like a piñata.

Someone bring me a tequila.

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Posted (edited)
On 8/1/2019 at 6:00 PM, Liatni said:

Hey, pirates aint idiots 😛 I mean, They are rumored  the ones that started putting lime in their grog to prevent scurvy first.

*further thought! Maybe the OP is more of a Navy Man or Trader at heart, and you know they are all about those spreadsheet and numbers.

I had not bothered with more than 2 crates myself, I mean.. there is only soo much gathering to be done in a setting for me. I find this thread interesting.

Who doesnt love spreadsheets!!!!!!!????? walk the plank right this moment you dogs!!!!

Edited by The D Legacy

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