New players and perception...why the new rules may not be perfect, but ARE a step in the right direction.

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

So let me tell you a story.  I am a leader in a very large Star Citizen Organization.  Some of our people play Atlas, as do I.  We are spread out.  I am trying to being them together, and bring new people in.  I recently convinced over a half dozen to buy.  They all have had positive things to say about the game.  I have learned that there are specific things that hold many people back from buying, and playing.

• ARK's reputation for offline raids.
• Atlas' reputation for offline raids
• Atlas' bad reviews, mostly complaining about network problems, bugs, and AI predator imbalance (solved or drastically improved), and offline destruction of what took a lot of effort to build (Not yet solved.)

I understand that those who liked the offline raiding in ARK, and like it here, will not like the changes, but to them, I can only say that Offline raiding is going away.  You can deal with that constructively or not...your choice.


OK, so I brought those guys into a server with absurdly boosted rates so that they could learn a lot by doing a lot, before the wipe on official.  Most want to go to official.  They know the rates won't be as good.  But they don't know the game, or it's mechanics, or the nuances to what works and what doesn't.  But they learn fast.  They make mistakes, but learn from them.  That's what I wanted.

So one mistake made, while I was not online...they were too aggressive.  They talked with our official players, and so to their understanding, you fight anyone who enters your grid, as on official, you or your Alliance, typically control a grid.  There are nuances but they had not the time or experience to understand this.  So when a new company...new to the server, but the top dog in their previous server, started moving into the same grid, my new guys thought it was their duty to attack on sight.  So they did.  After some interactions with this other crew, it is apparent to me that they know the Meta, but I am less than impressed with their PvP skills.  Four new players with less than a week in game, using 3 bears, and their own weapons killed every animal they brought out.  Bears, Tigers, Rhino, Elephant, Giraffe, flame cart horse, etc...  One of the new guys made the mistake of getting into their base with no way out, and made it into their crafting area.  He ran around in there with a bow, while two of the enemy popped in and out, trying to kill him...they never did.  He finally got out when they opened the doors. 

We had no explosives, so I knew it wouldn't be much of a raid, but didn't care.  I still knew they could learn things from this raid, and that was the point of letting them do it.  So it was going well until I tried to move the Galleon, and as soon as I hit W, all of us experienced a huge lag spike, and before we knew it, the Galleon was crashed into a cliff, well past the beach, and then disappeared under the mesh.  Looked like a scene from a horror movie when I whistled J to see if I could bring the crew to the surface. About 60 NPCs came up out of the ground.  But this was the beginning of the end.  It was a spur of the moment chance for some PvP action for the guys, not a true raid.  No forward base, no explosives, etc..  So the loss of the Galleon meant the end of the PvP action, as everything was on that ship.  So when you were out of ammo, or killed, you had no ability to continue fight.  Still, the fighting went on for a while.  Was fun.  All of the comments by my guys after the fight, were positive, and about how fun the fighting was.

When it was over, the typical flames and trash talk came from the defenders.  Me and my guys simply typed, "GG...was a fun fight."  Which gets us closer to the real issue here.  As a result of the good sportsmanship on the part of my guys, their leader showed good sportsmanship, and even asked for an invite to our discord.  We talked on discord and he seemed like a good guy.  He himself suggested that we be friendly and have ship battles against each other, not base raiding.  I thought that would be good.  You can build a lot of ships on that server, so I thought it would give my guys a lot of good experience building and fighting ships.

So the next day, we saw those guys coming in and out of our server.  Assumed that now that we were mostly friendly to each other, they were going back to concentrating on building their base in that server, so we ignored it.   We made plans to go together on a Gold run, and when we were two grids away, one of the guys looked at the company log, and saw that everything was destroyed.  Yes, the other company was not building their own base, they were prepping to raid us.  No problem with that, except that they waited for us to leave.  I have the DM screenshots to prove it.  Their leader admitted they were worried about player numbers.

So they waited till we left, then started destroying everything.  We got no death/destruction messages.  So after one of the guys saw this in the company logs, this is when I started the DM chat with the other leader.

My guys nearly quit the game over it.  Not because the stuff was destroyed.  They don't care bout that. Rates are so high they built back up in a day.  They were angry that the game mechanics allowed somebody to deny them a PvP fight.  They didn't care about the "defeat" in the raid...losing the galleon, and not destroying the other base.  They had a great time during the fighting.  These are hard core PvP players that keep our Organization in the top 3 in Star Marine and Arena Commander, in Star Citizen.  Those are largely broken right now due to new bugs, so they wanted to play other games while they wait for updates in Star Citizen.  They also didn't care about losing everything in the raid on our base.  The only thing they kept going on about, as I listened to them, was that they had been denied the ability to fight that day.  They were denied PvP action.  Their leader was banned from the Discord, not for raiding us, but for not keeping his word, and the offline raiding.  My guys want nothing to do with him, and see no value in people who can't keep their word.

When they came to Atlas, they were positive.  Comments were along the lines of "What is everyone crying about? This is awesome."  Yet, offline raiding nearly drove them from the game.  I talked them down, but I could see that their enthusiasm had been tempered.  People do not like PvO, and ARK and Atlas have a reputation of being where people who suck at PvP, hide and do PvO to boost their ego.  Convincing themselves that they are doing PvP, and are good at it.   PvO has to go.  The Devs know this, and are to be patted on the back for attempting to fix this problem.  Will this system have to have some changes...some tweaks...some additions...some deletions, to the mechanics?  Sure.  I don't think even the Devs think this is the end of the road for that part of the development.  But they are on the right track.  PvO is the #1 complaint of people who left, and those who never even bought, though they like the idea of the game.

Give it time to develop.  I will be the first to say that EA is not an excuse for bad decisions, but trying new mechanics to stop the PvO meta is NOT a bad decision.  It is THE right decision.

Edited March 16, 2019 by Captain Jack Shadow
spelling

[SIEGEGUN 57]

Somewhat similar experience, I have two friends I convinced to get the game and join my company recently. They love the concept and the game so far.  This is their first computer game, they are super experienced with consoles but neither one has ever owned a computer capable of playing games until I made them some. I was upfront and honest about the state of the game, the changes etc. They are running around official learning the game and having a blast. Much like your group I figured this is a good time to learn while we wait for the wipe.

Their largest concern by FAR was the offlining. They basically said if that didn't change they would not play.  I explained the changes coming and they were satisfied and happy. The point here is SAME concerns, my group doesn't mind getting killed etc etc. They like pvp. But the PvWall stuff they literally had no time or patience for. One has a 5 year old son he is raising by himself, he wants to have fun in a game. Not live in it.

So I agree, and have had a very similar experience literally just this week. Totally a step in the right direction.

[Back Stabbath 150]

Totally true.

Its the Ark mentality that PvO is somehow equivalent to pvp that destroys the game. When in fact its the opposite, If you cant handle pvp...you PVO.

 

 

[Bullet Force 151]

2 hours ago, Back Stabbath said:

Totally true.

Its the Ark mentality that PvO is somehow equivalent to pvp that destroys the game. When in fact its the opposite, If you cant handle pvp...you PVO.

 

 

No. Its the sandbox mentality that says you can do whatever you want in this game without any hand holding or artificial rules. That is why many players purchased this game in the first place. Free and unrestricted warfare in a sandbox environment.

There are always going to be a couple players that can't handle that kind of pressure and demand obstacles and barriers be put up to make the game easier for them. Players like yourself who require hand holding and regulations to stop "toxic/griefer/troll/evil/some other silly word" PVP players from killing you.

Edited March 16, 2019 by Bullet Force

[MajorAvatar 28]

9 minutes ago, Bullet Force said:

No. Its the sandbox mentality that says you can do whatever you want in this game without any hand holding or artificial rules. That is why many players purchased this game in the first place. Free and unrestricted warfare in a sandbox environment.

2

Where did you get that idea, of free and unrestricted warfare in a sandbox environment? I never saw that promise made, can you point me to it?

I bought this game, in the understanding that it is Early Access, that a lot can change over time, that they expect to release it 18 months from EA and that they will do continuous adjustments to the game. Maybe you bought another game then I did?

What you want, is not PvP. What you want, is offline raiding. In your own words, from another topic: You are PVE player that likes to play on a PvP server, without actually fighting against real online players when attacking their structures.

 

 

Edited March 16, 2019 by MajorAvatar

[Back Stabbath 150]

Nah bro....you cant handle pvp  run back to ark. Hide behind your zerg. 

Dont worry your enemies will goto sleep soon....you can win some big "fights". 

Hardcore mode bro.

[Bullet Force 151]

1 minute ago, MajorAvatar said:

Where did you get that idea, of free and unrestricted warfare in a sandbox environment? I never saw that promise made, can you point me to it?

I bought this game, in the understanding that it is Early Access, that a lot can change over time, that they expect to release it 18 months from EA and that they will do continuous adjustments to the game. Maybe you bought another game then I did?

What you want, is not PvP. What you want, is offline raiding. In your own words, from another topic: You are PVE player that likes to play on a PvP server, without actually fighting against real online players when attacking their structures.

 

 

I never said that.

Just now, Back Stabbath said:

Nah bro....you cant handle pvp  run back to ark. Hide behind your zerg. 

Dont worry your enemies will goto sleep soon....you can win some big "fights". 

Hardcore mode bro.

Explain to me then why with the new changes I will be prevented from attacking you even when you are online.

No matter how you try and spin its a PVE minded change for casuals and noncompetitive players. 

[Back Stabbath 150]

Your giant zerg will be able to overrun most islands by buying tokens .

Get over it. There will be pvp on the seas. 

The fun kind with actual people. You want the zerg kind with your giant mob jumping one or two randoms here and there.  Wow...fun.

Most people find that boring as fuck anyways bro 

Buy a token  drop your war.. zerg the smaller clans down..which you wil,with huge numbers.   At least they will have a chance to fight now. 

Lots of clans wont be able to have numbers on for even the full 9 hours straight.. you'll still have a chance to win some battles yourself while people sleep. You can even pretend you are still a pvper.

[MajorAvatar 28]

13 minutes ago, Bullet Force said:

I never said that.

Explain to me then why with the new changes I will be prevented from attacking you even when you are online.

No matter how you try and spin its a PVE minded change for casuals and noncompetitive players. 

You are really stuck in your mindset. You say it yourself, you can still PvP, you can just not attack the base and parked ships 24/7 unless you declared war.

What is good about this? 9 hours a day is a reasonable time, to stay close and online to defend your island, bases, and ships. In the other time, you can explore, attack enemy bases and ships, pvp, do all the fun stuff instead of babysitting your gear, island, and base.

What do we want?

We want to have fun, go out, explore, do PvP, attack ships on the sea when all players are on it and bases when they are being defended. We want to play with friends, people we know not some unknowns drafted for base defense and farming.

What do YOU seem to want?

You seem to want to sink ships when players are offline, in port. You want to break into bases and loot stuff when players are off. You want everyone to defend their bases 24/7 or lose all their stuff. You want people forced to play in large groups, of unknown people, just to have a tiny chance to one day do something fun.

--

 

Honestly, i would argue further, that it would be in the best interest of the game, to keep the companies SMALL  (They started with 1k, went to 500, now down to 250, still too large) 20-25 people is fun, MAYBE... 50 but 250 is still way too much.

 

 

 

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

3 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

Players like yourself who require hand holding and regulations to stop "toxic/griefer/troll/evil/some other silly word" PVP players from killing you.

Stop flopping on the ground like a toddler.  PvO is going away.  You will no longer be able to PvO against undefended targets.  You will no longer be able to avoid PvP.  You have made your position clear.  You want to be able to avoid fights, and hide beyond the false belief that those who want to PvO are somehow hardcore.  Not a single thing that's hardcore about demolishing undefended bases and ships.  If you think ARK and Atlas to this point is PvP when you are attacking Offline targets, then you don't understand the meaning of PvP, and you aren't hardcore.  Hardcore PvP players seek out PvP against other PEOPLE, not AI that cannot stop anything.  PvP players prefer playing the multiplayer parts of games, because they are playing against people.  Offlining somebody is the same as playing single player, or Co-Op multiplayer.  You aren't playing against people, so stop calling that PvP, because it is NOT.

You simply don't understand what PvP is.  You toss around terms like Sandbox without the slightest understanding what the term means in a game, and labeling things that balance the game, as hand holding.  By your definition, you should be able to build on ships in a totally unrestricted manner...no restrictions at all, which of course is absurd, and would result in things sailing around the ocean that look more like floating cities.  The truth is, there are literally no games that are "Sandbox," by your definition.  They all have limitations of one sort or another.  Most people confuse the terms Open World, Free Roaming, and Sandbox.  The truth is, very few games these days fit neatly into any one category, which is why the terms are so confused.  Most games these days have elements of these terms in them, with restrictions.  Many games that are considered Open World, or Free Roaming, still restrict your movement.  Many games that are sandbox, still have limitations on what you can actually do.  So you say Atlas is supposed to be Sandbox.  Can you build a floating castle?  Can you just walk up to a Dragon and ride it for the rest of the game?  Oh, that's right...there are limitations on that.  You have to tame it, and only get to keep it for a short time.

The term you seem the most ignorant about is the term Hand-holding.  This is used to describe things in Single Player games, mostly, but it always describes the game making what should be a challenging task, super easy, such as in Mass Effect Andromeda.  No need to actually search for anything...just scan...and not only that, but the game even tells you when you should scan.  That's hand-holding.  This has nothing to do with a game mechanic that seeks to make sure both sides have a chance to actually be in game for the fight.  I don't remember the description for Atlas saying, "This is a game of 'he who can stay up the latest, wins'"  Just because you have no life outside the game, does not mean you should win.

I have seen that mentality among MMORPG players.  They hate the idea that if they have 4K hours in a game, that somebody with 200 hours should have the same abilities as them.  They think that they have earned the right to be better.  Of course, this kills games.  Who will join this game in the future when word gets out that you have no chance.  Who would being their gaming org here when everybody is running around with Legendary to Mythical gear, and anyone who comes into the game at that point, is just annihilated before they can get to that level.  I've seen the difference that a common BP cannon that is boosted through crow and dolphin, can do to vanilla ship structures.  Stripped planks off in one shot.  This is why games die.  Many games have struggled with this.  How do you make the game deep and interesting, and yet fun for everyone?  WoW suffered and had to be modified, because one Paladin could wipe out 50 newer players with ease.  Eve had problems attracting new gaming orgs after a couple of years because people knew they could not compete, so some changes had to be made.  So imagine this...somebody who thinks that his experience of being there from day 1, believes that his experience was the same as somebody who joins 2 years later.  Wrong.  He didn't start in an environment where everyone was game breakingly better leveled, equipped and experienced.  Yet, if he is ignorant, he will claim that the Devs are coddling the new players, if they make changes that help the new player survive in a game world more hostile than Day 1 players experienced.  Let's face it...we all understand this, which is why we rush to buy underdeveloped games in the first place.  We inherently know that it is better to be hear early, so we aren't that new guy coming into a more hostile world, at a huge disadvantage.

Like it or not, you are not hardcore, if you are asking to be able to demolish somebody's stuff, when they have no chance to stop you.  Not one single thing that is hardcore about attacking bases defended by AI, or very very lightly defended by a few hapless defenders who were unlucky enough to be the ones online when they are attacked.  All this change is going to do, is make it such that everyone has a reasonable chance to be online when the bigger battles take place.  It's not even true ORP.  This isn't much different than a shooter having a start clock that allows those with higher pinks, and weaker computers, to get into the game before the action starts.  Before they had these clocks, people from the other side could be in your spawn area before you even loaded in.  That was a huge problem when some were on dial-up and some on cable, so the clocks appeared.

Like it or not, you keep crying that your disadvantage is being taken away.  Sorry...some people have jobs, families, chores around the house, etc...  Some of us actually have women in our lives, not named Sis, Mom, Aunt, or Grandma.  Just because you don't, doesn't mean you should be able to knock somebody's base down, just because they can't be in game at the time.

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

4 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

I never said that.

Explain to me then why with the new changes I will be prevented from attacking you even when you are online.

No matter how you try and spin its a PVE minded change for casuals and noncompetitive players. 

Easy.  It sets a window, and incredibly large window, when your players should have a reasonable chance to be online.  Not just 10 in a company of 100, to defend against a Mega that floods the server.  No...this allows as many of your players to be online as possible.  Just because I am the first one to get home, and have nor chores I need to do, and dinner is not for another hour, so I log in...that does not mean PvP should happen at that moment.  That's like saying that when the two sides are filling up in CoD, that the battle should start just because one person logged in, and your side is full.

 

The idea here is to get MORE PvP into a game that claims to be PVP.  The mechanics at present encourage and reward PvO.  The Devs have said that is going away.  No amount of campaigning by you is going to change that.  Many more people left the game because of PvO, than actually play the game now, and even more refuse to buy the game because of this reputation.

I simply don't get this entitled attitude that some have, that other players should just exist for their amusement.  People play the game for their own enjoyment, not yours.  They don't build ships and bases, to give you something to knock down while they sleep, and they won't keep doing so.  Simple as that.  If you got your way, there won't be a game in 6 months.

[Mike L 71]

The game is balanced for ONLINE combat vs players, as was ark. 

It is not balanced for players messing with your stuff while offline, and if they had had orp then transitioned to this war system, there would be a lot more players playing right now. 

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

Agree, because it was the offline destruction of their ships and bases, that caused so many people to leave.

[Bullet Force 151]

3 hours ago, Mike L said:

The game is balanced for ONLINE combat vs players, as was ark. 

It is not balanced for players messing with your stuff while offline, and if they had had orp then transitioned to this war system, there would be a lot more players playing right now. 

ARK has no ORP or any other kind of hand holding system and yet it remains immensely far more popular then this game. 

8 hours ago, Back Stabbath said:

Your giant zerg will be able to overrun most islands by buying tokens .

Get over it. There will be pvp on the seas. 

The fun kind with actual people. You want the zerg kind with your giant mob jumping one or two randoms here and there.  Wow...fun.

Most people find that boring as fuck anyways bro 

Buy a token  drop your war.. zerg the smaller clans down..which you wil,with huge numbers.   At least they will have a chance to fight now. 

Lots of clans wont be able to have numbers on for even the full 9 hours straight.. you'll still have a chance to win some battles yourself while people sleep. You can even pretend you are still a pvper.

So now you have basically admitted that you are against fighting other online players in PVP unless its "fair" to them.

So no strategic surprises or tactical options permitted anymore 

[Bullet Force 151]

3 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

Agree, because it was the offline destruction of their ships and bases, that caused so many people to leave.

No it wasn't. People left because there was nothing to do in the game. 3 ships is all we got to fight with. This new PVP Lite change isn't going to help the situation at all. In fact it will have the exact opposite effect. It will drive away many players who were prepared to rejoin after the wipe with the expectation that there would be a lot of PVP and combat in the first few weeks (which is normally the case after a wipe).

The devs are saying to these folks, these PVP minded fellas that you shouldn't bother coming back because you won't be able to have any fun anymore, there is not going to be PVP on PVP servers. That's the message us dedicated PVP players are hearing loud and clear.

[Mike L 71]

6 minutes ago, Bullet Force said:

ARK has no ORP or any other kind of hand holding system and yet it remains immensely far more popular then this game.

Ark orp officials were more active on average than the other officials. 

Even though the non orp cluster was huge in comparison, which made it more desirable because there were many more servers to hide your base in. 

Orp in ark was successful, should have been applied over all officials. 

That's what I mean by it was balanced for online raiding. 

It was always more fun knowing your base, if ended would be ended with a fight, rather than regular official network which was, you know it will be raided so you need to exists on multiple servers to be remotely safe. 

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

15 minutes ago, Bullet Force said:

No it wasn't. People left because there was nothing to do in the game. 3 ships is all we got to fight with. This new PVP Lite change isn't going to help the situation at all. In fact it will have the exact opposite effect. It will drive away many players who were prepared to rejoin after the wipe with the expectation that there would be a lot of PVP and combat in the first few weeks (which is normally the case after a wipe).

The devs are saying to these folks, these PVP minded fellas that you shouldn't bother coming back because you won't be able to have any fun anymore, there is not going to be PVP on PVP servers. That's the message us dedicated PVP players are hearing loud and clear.

This is not ARK.  This game is also trying to attract a lot of people that don't like ARK.  Also, the only thing that kept ARK going was the DLC.  Player numbers dropped a lot before each DLC, and then would pick up for a short while, and then drop off again.  New creatures, and new biomes, and new engrams to learn and use, kept people going, but withing a couple of months after the DLC released, numbers would drop again.

People did not like grinding for hours to get a hundred turrets up, only to have somebody easily bypass them while they were offline. 

ARK was fading out.  Many people I knew stopped playing, and I went to modded PvE to enjoy building mods to play with.  There are always a group of hardcore players that stick with a game long after it's popularity reduces.  ARK is not dead yet, but the people who like offline raiding, and think that is actual PvP, are there, and happy with that game.  This game is going to attempt to be an actual PvP game. Good luck with your PvO experience in ARK, if PvO is what you want.

[Bullet Force 151]

2 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

I went to modded PvE to enjoy building mods to play with. 

 

I always had the inkling that underneath the surface you a were PVE and you have just confirmed my suspicions. Now I have to ask the question why do folks like you go on a PVP server and then start demanding it become more like a PVE server that you are used to playing on? Why not just stick to you know PVE? It seems to be where you belong.

2 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

There are always a group of hardcore players that stick with a game long after it's popularity reduces.  ARK is not dead yet, but the people who like offline raiding, and think that is actual PvP, are there, and happy with that game.  This game is going to attempt to be an actual PvP game. Good luck with your PvO experience in ARK, if PvO is what you want.

It's clear you most likely didn't play PVP in ARK hardly at all. There was a lot of lot of raiding that happened while players were online especially among the larger tribes. ARK was an example of a game where there was true PVP. No silly rules, no regulations, no hand holding. The strongest prevailed and the weak perished that is the natural order of things and it worked well in ARK. Players that were smart were rewarded while lazy and idiotic players were cleansed.

Atlas is now attempting to implementing a formula where clever players are stalled and lazy players are protected. Going by the player count, it is not a winning formula...

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

3 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

 

I always had the inkling that underneath the surface you a were PVE and you have just confirmed my suspicions. Now I have to ask the question why do folks like you go on a PVP server and then start demanding it become more like a PVE server that you are used to playing on? Why not just stick to you know PVE? It seems to be where you belong.

It's clear you most likely didn't play PVP in ARK hardly at all. There was a lot of lot of raiding that happened while players were online especially among the larger tribes. ARK was an example of a game where there was true PVP. No silly rules, no regulations, no hand holding. The strongest prevailed and the weak perished that is the natural order of things and it worked well in ARK. Players that were smart were rewarded while lazy and idiotic players were cleansed.

Atlas is now attempting to implementing a formula where clever players are stalled and lazy players are protected. Going by the player count, it is not a winning formula...

You don't know much.  You see, I played both PvP, and PvE.  At the end, I was playing PvE, because PvP was boring.  Same old same old.  Only a non-PvPer like yourself would understand that real PvPers need a challenge.  I played PvP, then PvE, while playing PvP in Star Citizen.  At the very end, we tried PvP again, and it was still boring.  I enjoy challenges, and wanted to challenge myself on builds.  With a boosted server with building mods, I was able to do so.  I know your ability to think outside of the box is limited, but you can actually do both, PvP and PvE.  Liking one does no disqualify you from the other.

You aren't impressing anyone.  You are a toddler thrashing around on the floor because your easy mode is being taken away from you.  Like it or not, your easy mode PvO is not coming back to Atlas.  So either leave, or get used to the new rules.  The old rules are gone forever.  You will have to PvE.

Go to 4:16.
 

 

 

Edited March 17, 2019 by Captain Jack Shadow

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

3 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

 

I always had the inkling that underneath the surface you a were PVE and you have just confirmed my suspicions. Now I have to ask the question why do folks like you go on a PVP server and then start demanding it become more like a PVE server that you are used to playing on? Why not just stick to you know PVE? It seems to be where you belong.

It's clear you most likely didn't play PVP in ARK hardly at all. There was a lot of lot of raiding that happened while players were online especially among the larger tribes. ARK was an example of a game where there was true PVP. No silly rules, no regulations, no hand holding. The strongest prevailed and the weak perished that is the natural order of things and it worked well in ARK. Players that were smart were rewarded while lazy and idiotic players were cleansed.

Atlas is now attempting to implementing a formula where clever players are stalled and lazy players are protected. Going by the player count, it is not a winning formula...

You don't know much.  You see, I played both PvP, and PvE.  At the end, I was playing PvE, because PvP was boring.  Same old same old.  Only a non-PvPer like yourself would understand that real PvPers need a challenge.  I played PvP, then PvE, while playing PvP in Star Citizen.  At the very end, we tried PvP again, and it was still boring.  I enjoy challenges, and wanted to challenge myself on builds.  With a boosted server with building mods, I was able to do so.  I know your ability to think outside of the box is limited, but you can actually do both, PvP and PvE.  Liking one does no disqualify you from the other.

You aren't impressing anyone.  You are a toddler thrashing around on the floor because your easy mode is being taken away from you.  Like it or not, your easy mode PvO is not coming back to Atlas.  So either leave, or get used to the new rules.  The old rules are gone forever.  You will have to PvE.

Go to 4:16.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwZhQuMTHyk

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

3 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

 

I always had the inkling that underneath the surface you a were PVE and you have just confirmed my suspicions. Now I have to ask the question why do folks like you go on a PVP server and then start demanding it become more like a PVE server that you are used to playing on? Why not just stick to you know PVE? It seems to be where you belong.

It's clear you most likely didn't play PVP in ARK hardly at all. There was a lot of lot of raiding that happened while players were online especially among the larger tribes. ARK was an example of a game where there was true PVP. No silly rules, no regulations, no hand holding. The strongest prevailed and the weak perished that is the natural order of things and it worked well in ARK. Players that were smart were rewarded while lazy and idiotic players were cleansed.

Atlas is now attempting to implementing a formula where clever players are stalled and lazy players are protected. Going by the player count, it is not a winning formula...

You don't know much.  You see, I played both PvP, and PvE.  At the end, I was playing PvE, because PvP was boring.  Same old same old.  Only a non-PvPer like yourself would understand that real PvPers need a challenge.  I played PvP, then PvE, while playing PvP in Star Citizen.  At the very end, we tried PvP again, and it was still boring.  I enjoy challenges, and wanted to challenge myself on builds.  With a boosted server with building mods, I was able to do so.  I know your ability to think outside of the box is limited, but you can actually do both, PvP and PvE.  Liking one does no disqualify you from the other.

You aren't impressing anyone.  You are a toddler thrashing around on the floor because your easy mode is being taken away from you.  Like it or not, your easy mode PvO is not coming back to Atlas.  So either leave, or get used to the new rules.  The old rules are gone forever.  You will have to PvE.

Go to 4:16.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwZhQuMTHyk

 

And no matter how much you want to try to convince yourself otherwise, ARK did not have good PvP, except on rare occasions.  More often than not, it was PvO.  You are NOT a PvPer because you constantly prove that you don't understand the difference between the two.  Flak, Beer, and C4.  If that wasn't enough, soak the turrets with Stegos.  Not hard at all.  The fact that you seem to think this was challenging PvP proves that you are not to be listened to, and not to be respected.  You are NOT a PvPer.  You like ARK?  Go back to it.

[Bullet Force 151]

48 minutes ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

You don't know much.  You see, I played both PvP, and PvE.  At the end, I was playing PvE, because PvP was boring.  Same old same old.  Only a non-PvPer like yourself would understand that real PvPers need a challenge.  I played PvP, then PvE, while playing PvP in Star Citizen.  At the very end, we tried PvP again, and it was still boring.  I enjoy challenges, and wanted to challenge myself on builds.  With a boosted server with building mods, I was able to do so.  I know your ability to think outside of the box is limited, but you can actually do both, PvP and PvE.  Liking one does no disqualify you from the other.

You aren't impressing anyone.  You are a toddler thrashing around on the floor because your easy mode is being taken away from you.  Like it or not, your easy mode PvO is not coming back to Atlas.  So either leave, or get used to the new rules.  The old rules are gone forever.  You will have to PvE.

Go to 4:16.
 

 

 

LOL I am sorry but with that video you have revealed yourself to be a textbook PVE player and most likely some kind of role player as well. When I think of how a stereotypical PVE player would build their base in ARK your video now provides me with loads of fresh new examples to laugh at. You sure as hell did not build any that on an Official ARK PVP server that much is obvious.

Going through that video all I see in that video is one pointless aesthetic base after pointless aesthetic base. None have any defensive value what so ever, neither are they efficient designs. Dear me you even have mock medieval towers in one of the bases  

In all honestly if I came across any of those bases on a PVP server I wouldn't hesitate to immediately raid it. It would be like taking candy from a baby. I guess at least you didn't have your generated room covered in decorative glass (yes someone actually did that on a PVP server....). That's one positive I guess 

Thanks for coming clean, I appreciate it. Now we all know your background and why you want more PVE on PVP servers.

[pzzuii 2]

@ Captain Jack Shadow:

If you could find out earlier, that there are enemies in your claim: you can teleport back by using the bed (fast travel), in your base there should be a box with cloth and weapons... so you can defend your base. 

So the problem was that you didnt get the information early enough - isnt it? So a warning system would help, dont you think?

The second problem is, that the walls and the whole base was destoryed in such a short time... Wouldn't it help, if the structures were stronger? 

I agree that there should be some changes to prevent those PVO, but to be honest I think stronger walls and a warning system, when someone is moving into your land, will be a good step in the right direction. I cannot see what the new coming up system will change regarding to PVO - Okay, we have the offline raid protection, but we have 9 hours of raiding time... during this time we have the same problems like before... 

 

[Bullet Force 151]

4 minutes ago, pzzuii said:

@ Captain Jack Shadow:

If you could find out earlier, that there are enemies in your claim: you can teleport back by using the bed (fast travel), in your base there should be a box with cloth and weapons... so you can defend your base. 

So the problem was that you didnt get the information early enough - isnt it? So a warning system would help, dont you think?

The second problem is, that the walls and the whole base was destoryed in such a short time... Wouldn't it help, if the structures were stronger? 

I agree that there should be some changes to prevent those PVO, but to be honest I think stronger walls and a warning system, when someone is moving into your land, will be a good step in the right direction. I cannot see what the new coming up system will change regarding to PVO - Okay, we have the offline raid protection, but we have 9 hours of raiding time... during this time we have the same problems like before... 

 

The problem with the new system is say your sailing around you come across a base. You whip out your spyglass and see its poorly defended full of silly aesthetic features and you think to yourself i bet some PVE noob built this will be an easy raid.

So you sail up to it with your warship and the enemy players man their cannons and start shooting at you. You shoot back but oh whats this your not doing any damage to them?  Ah then you remember with the new system you have to send them a polite message telling them you'll be attacking them tomorrow at noon, plz be ready for us...

[Willard 245]

5 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

 

I always had the inkling that underneath the surface you a were PVE and you have just confirmed my suspicions. Now I have to ask the question why do folks like you go on a PVP server and then start demanding it become more like a PVE server that you are used to playing on? Why not just stick to you know PVE? It seems to be where you belong.

It's clear you most likely didn't play PVP in ARK hardly at all. There was a lot of lot of raiding that happened while players were online especially among the larger tribes. ARK was an example of a game where there was true PVP. No silly rules, no regulations, no hand holding. The strongest prevailed and the weak perished that is the natural order of things and it worked well in ARK. Players that were smart were rewarded while lazy and idiotic players were cleansed.

Atlas is now attempting to implementing a formula where clever players are stalled and lazy players are protected. Going by the player count, it is not a winning formula...

Lazy players are protected  Lol. You mean players who are not online 24/7? Jesus man, just stop. You are embarrasing yourself. 

Go play ARK and offline someone if it brings you such a joy to offline someone. No more offline raids in Atlas, sorry to tell you, you are the minority. 

9 hours ago, Bullet Force said:

ARK has no ORP or any other kind of hand holding system and yet it remains immensely far more popular then this game. 

So now you have basically admitted that you are against fighting other online players in PVP unless its "fair" to them.

So no strategic surprises or tactical options permitted anymore 

 

This killed me man. So now "strategic surprise and tactical option" is a name for offline raiding  People are really creative while defending their offline raiding  

Edited March 17, 2019 by Willard