wieght sails

[lordkhan4444 113]

so patch  notes say 1.3 to now a new 4k on these sails, what does this mean exacly do I get 4k extra weight on my boat now?

[Percieval 1,067]

Yes I believe so. 

[Remo 43]

yes a gal with 6 weight sails will give you an extra 24k weight add 6 cargo racks and a gal can carry 66k in weight just sails plus rack, so you can overload even more with the spare weight of gal itself, but remember weight sails are slower than speed sails so you take a speed hit from them as well as a speed hit of 40% from the gargo racks themselves.

[Archsenex 309]

Rough math is showing that it is worth replacing a speed sail with a weight sail at a much lower percentage than before, close to 50%.  Remember that the weight sail actually helps the speed sails by reducing the amount they're affected by weight.  2 Weight Sails on cargo galleons, possibly 3, could stand up well in practical usage and still leave you at practical speeds (> 50%).

 

And do not use all rack slots, that's suicide.  Consider 3-4 on a galleon, 1-2 on a brig, and only 1 on a schooner.  At those levels the Speed penalty is smaller than the speed penalty for the weight they give you.

[Kummba 164]

3 minutes ago, Archsenex said:

Rough math is showing that it is worth replacing a speed sail with a weight sail at a much lower percentage than before, close to 50%.  Remember that the weight sail actually helps the speed sails by reducing the amount they're affected by weight.  2 Weight Sails on cargo galleons, possibly 3, could stand up well in practical usage and still leave you at practical speeds (> 50%).

 

And do not use all rack slots, that's suicide.  Consider 3-4 on a galleon, 1-2 on a brig, and only 1 on a schooner.  At those levels the Speed penalty is smaller than the speed penalty for the weight they give you.

YEAH great changes, you get jebaited into sailing turtle speed. This does not help the game at all. Also have fun with the new SotD behaviour at that speed level.

[Archsenex 309]

3 minutes ago, Kummba said:

YEAH great changes, you get jebaited into sailing turtle speed. This does not help the game at all. Also have fun with the new SotD behaviour at that speed level.

"That speed level" is faster than you were going before

[Kummba 164]

5 minutes ago, Archsenex said:

"That speed level" is faster than you were going before

I never go below 60% speed, you dont know me!

[Archsenex 309]

Just now, Kummba said:

I never go below 60% speed, you dont know me!

Neither do I, which is why I won't be using all 6 racks on a galleon.

[Kummba 164]

3 minutes ago, Archsenex said:

Neither do I, which is why I won't be using all 6 racks on a galleon.

Will you deliver the math tho?

How fast is your galleon without any cargo, just the ship itself?

[Martyn 246]

I've sailed my cargo gally with only 500 weight to spare.  With full ellys and a full giraffe.. The last 2 hours of which, was on slacking wind and calm seas.  Just pushed past the sotd and killed them with chasers.

That said.. I've also been sunk once as well.. by the sotd. Although, technically, they died first.

Edited June 1, 2019 by Martyn

[Kummba 164]

On 6/1/2019 at 11:08 PM, Martyn said:

The last 2 hours of which, was on slacking wind and calm seas.

Fairy tales that is! Stay to the truth.

On another note, what is the top speed of such ship?

[Wichtelman 8]

can you pls show the math on 6 weight sails + cargo rack vs 6 speed sails or any other combination?

would be interesting to know how much time is needed from point a to b...

[Vorxius 249]

15 minutes ago, Wichtelman said:

can you pls show the math on 6 weight sails + cargo rack vs 6 speed sails or any other combination?

would be interesting to know how much time is needed from point a to b...

Something I'm very interested in as well.

Our merchant schooner does about ~19 kts at half weight, so wonder how much a cargo rack would drag that down, vs putting on a weight sail......

Personally think the cargo racks are too violent on penalties to be useful.  The racks were one of the things I was most looking forward to, but alas the penalties are too severe for us

[seruum 56]

Im going to load a gally full weight sails and cargo racks and just have some battle brigs in tow to ward of sotd

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

I think they realized that they had to do something with the weight and handling sails, as people simply weren't using them, especially in PvP.   Every Brig I saw, had 3 speed sails.  Every Schooner I saw, had 2 Speed sails, 1 large, and 1 small.

I really wish they would sort the sails for the smaller ships.  Give us different sails for them.  Because they are smaller, you nee d a hook to want to use them.  So why not combination sails?  Combinations of

• Speed + Weight
• Speed + Handlin
• Weight + Handling

You choose which combo you want, depending on how you intend to use the ship.  As it stands, the smaller ships do not have their historical advantages of speed and maneuverability.  So why not give them that, but also give them some other options, to make them more attractive?

[Kummba 164]

19 hours ago, Vorxius said:

Something I'm very interested in as well.

Our merchant schooner does about ~19 kts at half weight, so wonder how much a cargo rack would drag that down, vs putting on a weight sail......

Personally think the cargo racks are too violent on penalties to be useful.  The racks were one of the things I was most looking forward to, but alas the penalties are too severe for us

No he does not! He does ~17 knots at half weight, with strong wind. In a storm he can be faster but not 19.

(Large) Weight sail on a schooner, wait i have to kms.

 

19 hours ago, Wichtelman said:

can you pls show the math on 6 weight sails + cargo rack vs 6 speed sails or any other combination?

would be interesting to know how much time is needed from point a to b... 

Someone reported 4 knots. I would think u just go with baseline speed (as going into with wind with speedsails).

IF weight sail is still 0.6 of speed sail and a zero weight galleon is traveling with 24 knots top speed, then the comparison for a galleon with 6000/39000 base weight stats would be like: (NO baseline displayed)

Top speed in knots versus weight of Galleon, blue 6*LSS, red 6*weight sails. (10 Knots top speed = <6knots speed for lowest wind)

As i dont have a galleon to verify it, and i am also not interested in doing it, maybe someone can check back.

 

Generall for speed measure: If you use a sextant, there is only a ~1 minute window where the wind is the strongest, take that value and average it abit. The sextant is using hight (waves) for speed calculation also, this has an (fake) impact which should be eleminated.

 

The formula is (1-currW/maxCapacity)^0,5 *topspeed in knots * speedMalus

speedMalus:

LSS  :  1

LWS : 0,6 (not sure, mybe buffed)

LHS: 0,75 (not sure)

Cargo : 0,933 to 0,6 for galleon.

topspeed:

schooner 24

brig 22

galleon 24

All this values got changed in the past and might have changed allready again, i dont verify them each patch.

If you find different behaviour, please report back!

[Talono 434]

Well, as it is a mess to sail around even to a neighbor island, with stuff to collect and to do on that island, you can spend several hours.

Hauling cargo over 5 grits can take you half a day. Because of this i only build one-way-schooners to haul cargo. Going back and forth would be a whole real day... no thanks. Better wait for double harvest weekend and build a throw-away ship.

If i imagine that my Schooner will not only be limited to 60% max speed but hindered even more by the weight penalty... no thanks Sir.

I better go out with my girlfriend than to spend a day with cargo hauling with devs latest full failure mechanics.

[Kummba 164]

13 minutes ago, Talono said:

Well, as it is a mess to sail around even to a neighbor island, with stuff to collect and to do on that island, you can spend several hours.

Hauling cargo over 5 grits can take you half a day. Because of this i only build one-way-schooners to haul cargo. Going back and forth would be a whole real day... no thanks. Better wait for double harvest weekend and build a throw-away ship.

If i imagine that my Schooner will not only be limited to 60% max speed but hindered even more by the weight penalty... no thanks Sir.

I better go out with my girlfriend than to spend a day with cargo hauling with devs latest full failure mechanics.

You are just ignorant, unwilling to explore the deep of the game, not saying you are doing it wrong when you have fun with it.

I haul ~10k weight cargos at a time with a leveled brig, needing <1 hour for the 5 grids!

22 minutes ago, Talono said:

cargo hauling with devs latest full failure mechanics

This mechanics made it so i can haul >50% more at a given speed (racks, not sails). YES full fail.

[Vorxius 249]

2 hours ago, Kummba said:

No he does not! He does ~17 knots at half weight, with strong wind. In a storm he can be faster but not 19.

I have a screenshot of doing ~20.5 kts in a storm.  19 is fairly regular.

[Kummba 164]

1 minute ago, Vorxius said:

I have a screenshot of doing ~20.5 kts in a storm.  19 is fairly regular.

It is about the 19@50% weight not max speed, i can go almost 22 knots with empty schooner.

[Vorxius 249]

1 minute ago, Kummba said:

It is about the 19@50% weight not max speed, i can go almost 22 knots with empty schooner.

Then you and I get different numbers.. I had half weight in gems, I know this as we attempted to build a sub and needed three types of gem.  On way back, bounced off ~19 most of the way until we hit a deadzone, with barely a whisper of wind, and went down to 12kts

All I'm trying to figure out, is, what would make a bigger difference to boat effectiveness (speed) a weight sail or cargo rack.  I'm thinking the diminishing returns & penalties of cargo racks would ultimately hit speed more than a weight sail...   I fear that it's better to still not carry stuff, and let speed by the ally, rather than play all merchant ship and load up  with either and be strangled of 40% speed.

[Kummba 164]

For schooner its easy: EDIT: easy bc only one "main" sail.

Weight sail: ~40% speed hit for 4k max weight.

1 Rack: 20% speed hit for 6,4k "free" weight.

Edited June 4, 2019 by Kummba

[gnihar 111]

5 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

I think they realized that they had to do something with the weight and handling sails, as people simply weren't using them, especially in PvP.   Every Brig I saw, had 3 speed sails.  Every Schooner I saw, had 2 Speed sails, 1 large, and 1 small.

I really wish they would sort the sails for the smaller ships.  Give us different sails for them.  Because they are smaller, you nee d a hook to want to use them.  So why not combination sails?  Combinations of

• Speed + Weight
• Speed + Handlin
• Weight + Handling

You choose which combo you want, depending on how you intend to use the ship.  As it stands, the smaller ships do not have their historical advantages of speed and maneuverability.  So why not give them that, but also give them some other options, to make them more attractive?

I think they should ditch speed sails as such.

Speed gives ENORMOUS advantage in pvp. And the only thing that adds or subtracts from it, should be weight balancing.

To balance it, speed sails might become something called turning speed sails, allowing for faster turn.

Edited June 4, 2019 by gnihar

[Jack Shandy 242]

23 minutes ago, gnihar said:

I think they should ditch speed sails as such.

Speed gives ENORMOUS advantage in pvp. And the only thing that adds or subtracts from it, should be weight balancing.

To balance it, speed sails might become something called turning speed sails, allowing for faster turn.

They had speed sails right when the game launched, same speed as now but way less effective angle, but lots of people whinned and we have what we have now.

[Kummba 164]

1 hour ago, gnihar said:

To balance it, speed sails might become something called turning speed sails, allowing for faster turn. 

Just reduce speed of ship to turn faster, i let u figure out how to do that. And nerving the speed sail is not the answer.