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Myrmidon

Merge PvP and PvE

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21 minutes ago, Chucksteak said:

@Lotus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_mechanics

This is a common concept that can be seen in games everywhere.

MTG - more powerful cards cost more mana

^This is a blueprint costing more.

I never said EVERYTHING was unbalanced. We are talking about the balance in company size. Please focus on the topic you are responding too.

Diablo (all) - better gear is obtained with more time invested

^This is you farming blueprints.

See above.

Holy trinity of MMO - DD>Support>Tank>DD

^ what?

Are you new to MMORPGS? Google this please.

PUBG (Shooters) - Sniper hits harder, fires slower. AR fires faster, hits weaker

^galley vs schooner

Gally is faster, stronger and hits harder, no trade off for choosing it over a schooner, categorically better. Sorry, your wrong.

Civilizations - Bigger army takes a lot more gold and time to manage, less progress in other areas. Smaller army grants more flexibility in religion/science etc.

^the civ with a bigger army (mega) normally captures the city states (small tribes) in a few turns. The upkeep for the bigger army is maintenance so it's already baked in.

You have clearly never lost to religion or science, the easiest and fastest win cons. Play against immortals and better.

Divinity Original Sin 2 - Magic users are weaker to physical mobs, Physical users are weaker to magic mobs.

^I played a necromancer and had high damage, phys, magic resist. My brother made a type of paladin and was basically unkillable.

My mage would 1 shot his pally, I promise. The Necro is a mage that does physical DMG, its more a hybrid and can be specced differently.

On and on and on I could go.

There should always be a trade off when making a play style decision in a game.

^There is if you are in a small tribe you will die to a larger tribe if you can't beat them with skill.

You wont have even close to the amount of time, resources, tames, and gear available to you. Skill goes out of the window somewhere before 75 vs 2.

 

~Lotus

Yes we are talking about balance in company size and you put a bunch of random mechanics in. In terms of balance you are basically saying token decks should have an upkeep cost because they have to many tokens. In diablo you would be saying that you should be able to solo GR 140's if a group of 4 can run it. I asked what for your MMO reference because it's a little more intricate. For galley vs schooner it's about skill neither can easily sink the other. I stomp on immortals using military, no I have never lost to religion because as soon as I see it I stomp that civ because they invested too much tempo into a resource that yields no fighting capacity. Divinity is not a PvP game -_- We played PvP and a level 55 came up in full plate with weapons and got punched to death by a level 8 it was kinda pathetic how trash the guy was we played it off as a fluke but a major chunk of the players we came across in PvP didn't understand basics of the game it was just... sad.

~Lotus

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17 hours ago, Myrmidon said:

Since the beginning, I have felt that we should have PvE and PvP on the same grid. We have a 255 server grid. When i looked at NA PvP, there were 1600 people on it. That is 6 people per grid. This is extremely low. I feel that we should have a smaller number of Freeports located around Kraken grid. Instead of Lawless zones around the Freeports, we should have PvE zones. This allows the players to mix and to cater to both groups. It also adds a bit of danger for the PvEers. Want Ironwood or Twigs? Gotta travel through PvP territory. Rare resources should be a reason to leave PvE zones. This way, everything cannot be crafted in PvE zones. Kraken should remain a PvP zone. Attached is a (very) rudimentary drawing of what the grid may be like. Red is PvP zones, with the Kraken zone dead center. Blue is PvE/Freeports.

pvpvegrid.png

Let’s take out of the equation the toxic pvp players that wildcard breeds. As well as any very crappy mmo. Eve included.

here is the very hard reality check. For the most part people at their core aren’t good people at all. Even if you want to take a religious standpoint on it, cool, the Bible says we are born with sin. Depending on how we are raised and so forth which is usually sub par we will still be bad after adulthood. Look at how many people are in prison.

the odds that even 1 out of 10 of the people you game with are good people is almost impossible. Hell I’ll even use me as a good excuse. One of my buddies did a hit and run and there were 4 of us that were willing to testify to say they were with us the whole time. That is real loyalty. You have no clue what loyalty is.

Pvp and pve do not mix. They never will. 

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45 minutes ago, Realist said:

Pvp and pve do not mix. They never will. 

Except in:

Lineage 

Lineage 2

Wow

ESO 

Tera

Eve

......

Cmon now.

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3 hours ago, Lotus said:

Where was this tested? I've only ever seen things like that in RTS

~Lotus

I spoke about balance and the simple mechanic of risk/reward, a trade off of one negative for another positive in return a different negative. Pertaining to company size.

You asked for RL examples of when this is used in game logic. 

I gave you several examples. Of risking one thing to get another. The point is you give up something to get something. This brings balance. Im not really sure where the breakdown is here. Or why you would contest this. 

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8 minutes ago, Chucksteak said:

Except in:

Lineage 

Lineage 2

Wow

ESO 

Tera

Eve

......

Cmon now.

 

3 minutes ago, Chucksteak said:

I spoke about balance and the simple mechanic of risk/reward, a trade off of one negative for another positive in return a different negative. Pertaining to company size.

You asked for RL examples of when this is used in game logic. 

I gave you several examples. Of risking one thing to get another. The point is you give up something to get something. This brings balance. Im not really sure where the breakdown is here. Or why you would contest this. 

I understand where the lack of communication is now.

What I am saying is there's not really a successful game that has PvE combined with PvP where PvE players are happy and able to remain a smaller faction. The upkeep of running a large army in this game is crew maintaining so many ships and coordinating them. (It is awful on PvE and from what I saw on PvP the bigger tribes didn't even like doing it.)

The exchange of one thing for another is to turn something into an advantage. The advantage in this game is to trade your small community lifestyle to become a number in a big tribe. The risk is things like the guy that put up the racist sign in another thread and now his tribe is getting punished.

To me the PvP in this game is sluggish and slow and serves little fun for the amount of headache and work I need to do to get to the good stuff.

~Lotus

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If they wanted to incentivize making companies smaller, they should charge gold upkeep for players that scales with the company size.

 

1-5 : No upkeep

6-10: 10g/player

11-15: (10g/player)*1.2

15-20: (10g/player)*1.5

etc...

 

Numbers are pulled from my ass for illustration.

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19 hours ago, Myrmidon said:

No one says you have to leave the PvE zones. Trade with folks willing to make the trip to get any mats outside the PvE zones you might need. Pay them gold or other resources in return. You never have to leave your safe little box and it creates content for those that want to play a trader.

Well I'm glad you think they should design the game for your personal needs and amusement. Alot of us that are on PVE don't really feel like we should have to live in a bubble to play the game we would like to play. Part of the enjoyment is knowing there is a great big ocean out there full of islands to explore and resources to get.

But I do appreciate the fact that as a PVPer you deem us worthy enough to provide your infrastructure and trading opportunities as long as we know our place. How liberal of you🙄

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2 hours ago, Chucksteak said:

Except in:

Lineage 

Lineage 2

Wow

ESO 

Tera

Eve

......

Cmon now.

The only example of any importance was wow. Yes, wow was awesome and nothing can compare to it lol. Yeah I am serious. Wow was by far the most successful mmo ever. Not just by time but by numbers as wel.

wildcard is really stupid for going for an mmo but still trying to stay with ark.

nind you, before we go off that subject, ark was very successful regardless of bugs. Their biggest mistake was thinking they could move away from the ark setting and make a true mmo, regardless of pirates. This was an ark DLC and whoever tries to deny is an idiot 😂

you can say any mmo was successful but the true successful mmo was wow and in a big way. First thing they need to do is get rid of the idiotic player shop and make an auction house(really don’t care @boomervoncannon). 

Getting really tired of the sub par bullsgit they are trying to play. Enough of the EA crap. This isn’t EA. This is wildcard. They are always in EA. Enough with the excuses.

sorry @Chucksteak but if this isn’t exactly like WoW or exactly like ark then this game is done. I respect you enough to know you realize that.

there has been way too many stupid decisions they have made and now they are paying for it. They could have made this ark 2.0 and had a lot more success. Instead they chose greed and laziness. It is purely pathetic at this point 

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1 hour ago, Huck Finnley said:

Well I'm glad you think they should design the game for your personal needs and amusement. Alot of us that are on PVE don't really feel like we should have to live in a bubble to play the game we would like to play. Part of the enjoyment is knowing there is a great big ocean out there full of islands to explore and resources to get.

But I do appreciate the fact that as a PVPer you deem us worthy enough to provide your infrastructure and trading opportunities as long as we know our place. How liberal of you🙄

This. 

The arrogance of the OP's attitude in his suggestion is so ingrained in his thinking that he doesn't even recognize it and acts surprised when others take a dim view of being treated as set pieces there for his amusement regardless of their own preferences.

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6 minutes ago, Realist said:

 

you can say any mmo was successful but the true successful mmo was wow and in a big way. First thing they need to do is get rid of the idiotic player shop and make an auction house(really don’t care @boomervoncannon). 

 

And I still say auction house would be fundamentally contrary to the whole idea of what they've stated they want this game to be, and as such contrary to one of the main reasons it drew my interest in the first place.

Also since we're talking about wow, measuring everything against wow in the MMO space is a bit like measuring every basketball player from middle school on against Michael Jordan (LeBron is a nice guy but before you try to have a GOAT conversation and use his name, realize you're going to lose and lose hard and fast just on ring count alone. Kobe fans can bite me. The only other player who can put forth a meaningful case is Bill Russell.)

WOW was the outlier that destroyed the curve. Part of it's success was it obtained a level of momentum that became self perpetuating because player populations matter in an MMO, and WOW had by far the biggest. People played WOW in no small part because they knew there would always be lots of other people playing WOW. Using WOW as a yardstick quickly becomes meaningless because of how it left everything else in the dust. It's an outlier, and outliers often make poor tools for measuring. If every kid's jumper that isn't as good as Jordan's isn't a good basketball player, then every kid isn't a good basketball player. Nothing measures up and comparison becomes effectively meaningless.

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6 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

And I still say auction house would be fundamentally contrary to the whole idea of what they've stated they want this game to be, and as such contrary to one of the main reasons it drew my interest in the first place.

Also since we're talking about wow, measuring everything against wow in the MMO space is a bit like measuring every basketball player from middle school on against Michael Jordan (LeBron is a nice guy but before you try to have a GOAT conversation and use his name, realize you're going to lose and lose hard and fast just on ring count alone. Kobe fans can bite me. The only other player who can put forth a meaningful case is Bill Russell.)

WOW was the outlier that destroyed the curve. Part of it's success was it obtained a level of momentum that became self perpetuating because player populations matter in an MMO, and WOW had by far the biggest. People played WOW in no small part because they knew there would always be lots of other people playing WOW. Using WOW as a yardstick quickly becomes meaningless because of how it left everything else in the dust. It's an outlier, and outliers often make poor tools for measuring. If every kid's jumper that isn't as good as Jordan's isn't a good basketball player, then every kid isn't a good basketball player. Nothing measures up and comparison becomes effectively meaningless.

Uh, I am going to calm hulkshit on that boomer. Ark also left survival games in the dust and it wasn’t in good shape at all. At least wow was in damn good shape.

dont even try to disqualify wow as an example for an mmo. I really thought more of you than that. The fact you don’t want me to use wow is even worse. They need to fall in line as an mmo and if they want a role model then they have one. This game is crap man. It could be good but it’s crap(don’t you dare be one of the EA people).

i expected certain things from this game and I made sure to set my standards low and regardless it is still disappointing. I am actually really pissed about it.

i am not going to stand by and let people give excuses for something that should have been very good especially since it is very evident that it was being created a long time ago(regardless of copies assests) they already had a lot of time. Now it is time for them to stop making stupid decisions 

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1 minute ago, Realist said:

Uh, I am going to calm hulkshit on that boomer. Ark also left survival games in the dust and it wasn’t in good shape at all. At least wow was in damn good shape.

dont even try to disqualify wow as an example for an mmo. I really thought more of you than that. The fact you don’t want me to use wow is even worse. They need to fall in line as an mmo and if they want a role model then they have one. This game is crap man. It could be good but it’s crap(don’t you dare be one of the EA people).

i expected certain things from this game and I made sure to set my standards low and regardless it is still disappointing. I am actually really pissed about it.

i am not going to stand by and let people give excuses for something that should have been very good especially since it is very evident that it was being created a long time ago(regardless of copies assests) they already had a lot of time. Now it is time for them to stop making stupid decisions 

I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying so I'll clarify. Because WOW was successful to a rediculous degree, it makes a poor measuring stick for everything else in the same way that you don't want to measure every basketball player against Jordan. Almost everyone will look woefully inadequete by comparison.

Atlas is fairly obviously a dumpster fire at this point but saying it needs to live up to WOW in order to survive is an impossibly tall order. Let's try saying instead that it should refocus on trying to be more like the MMO it's creators said they set out to pattern it on, and be more like EVE. Eve has taken very tangible, very deliberate steps to create the long term successful game world and play environment that has evolved there. Grapeshot at this point feels scattershot and unfocused. They seem to be groping for who and what they want Atlas to be, and part of their failure to date is that the game has no clear identity to hang it's hat on that sets it apart from others. WOW's success was built on the existing success of a mammoth franchise that gave it a built in audience. It leveraged that to appeal to the broadest possible audience and succeeded brilliantly by drawing people into the MMO genre who would not otherwise have tried the genre. That success cannot be replicated. Grapeshot has neither the resources nor positioning to do so, and realistically neither does anyone else that I'm aware of.

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8 minutes ago, lordkhan4444 said:

I always thought ffxi was much better mmo than wow. call me crazy

Well I would almost agree with you if you said ffxiv. That was actually pretty damn awesome and I spent some time learning the professions.

that is why atlas is shit though. It isn’t a damn mmo. Not even sure n the slightest. It’s $@“@&@“ing ark. If it is ark then fine I am cool with that, but don’t try to sell this as an mmo.

you brought up a really good example. Final fantasy was an awesome rpg. Then it became a very successful mmo. This is probably the best example of crossing over to another genre(you actually made me want to play it again).

this game will never even amount to ark let alone wow or ff14 and that is really disappointing 

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3 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying so I'll clarify. Because WOW was successful to a rediculous degree, it makes a poor measuring stick for everything else in the same way that you don't want to measure every basketball player against Jordan. Almost everyone will look woefully inadequete by comparison.

Atlas is fairly obviously a dumpster fire at this point but saying it needs to live up to WOW in order to survive is an impossibly tall order. Let's try saying instead that it should refocus on trying to be more like the MMO it's creators said they set out to pattern it on, and be more like EVE. Eve has taken very tangible, very deliberate steps to create the long term successful game world and play environment that has evolved there. Grapeshot at this point feels scattershot and unfocused. They seem to be groping for who and what they want Atlas to be, and part of their failure to date is that the game has no clear identity to hang it's hat on that sets it apart from others. WOW's success was built on the existing success of a mammoth franchise that gave it a built in audience. It leveraged that to appeal to the broadest possible audience and succeeded brilliantly by drawing people into the MMO genre who would not otherwise have tried the genre. That success cannot be replicated. Grapeshot has neither the resources nor positioning to do so, and realistically neither does anyone else that I'm aware of.

Ok now I get what you are saying and I get it.

at the same time I was also not saying that is has to be as awesome as wow boomer. The whole damn reason I brought wow up in the first place was the damn auction house you are so set against. Btw F you for being against it. That is I very successful tool for the game.

i get why you don’t want it because of the bull shit they shoved down your throat in the beginning but I am pretty sure you know that isn’t happening anymore. It’s time for the damn auction house. Rather you like it or not the auction house actually kept wow alive for a long time.

i want this damn game to live and all of the idiots on this forum are single handedly screwing it up.if they want an mmo then they need to mimic wow. 

If they want a survival game they need to copy ark(proven successful, regardless of 1000’s of bugs).

this whole eve crap that everyone is on is going to kill the game. I don’t know what ever is and I don’t care. It’s not good enough because evidently they are trying it and they are sucking at it.

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Just now, Realist said:

Ok now I get what you are saying and I get it.

at the same time I was also not saying that is has to be as awesome as wow boomer. The whole damn reason I brought wow up in the first place was the damn auction house you are so set against. Btw F you for being against it. That is I very successful tool for the game.

i get why you don’t want it because of the bull shit they shoved down your throat in the beginning but I am pretty sure you know that isn’t happening anymore. It’s time for the damn auction house. Rather you like it or not the auction house actually kept wow alive for a long time.

i want this damn game to live and all of the idiots on this forum are single handedly screwing it up.if they want an mmo then they need to mimic wow. 

If they want a survival game they need to copy ark(proven successful, regardless of 1000’s of bugs).

this whole eve crap that everyone is on is going to kill the game. I don’t know what ever is and I don’t care. It’s not good enough because evidently they are trying it and they are sucking at it.

I'm not inherently against auction houses. I use them enthusiastically in other MMO's and love them. I'm against an auction house for Atlas because it would undermine the kind of trade environment they stated they were aiming to create, and one that I think if properly developed could be unique and engaging. So far properly developed hasn't been seen or heard from, so I'm dubious we'll get there any time soon if ever, but that is the reason for my being against AH for Atlas.

Do not by any stretch of the imagination judge Eve by Atlas. If you're not familiar with Eve, the short version is that it has by far the most complex and sophisticated game economy of any MMO out there. It is the only game which has a full time economist on staff. If you are talking about gaming economies, there is Eve, and then there is everything else. I think Grapeshot aspired to at least some of what Eve does without really understanding it or having any clear idea of how to go about creating their version of it. But dismissing something just because you're ignorant of it doesn't advance your argument, it just shows it's limitations.

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4 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

I'm not inherently against auction houses. I use them enthusiastically in other MMO's and love them. I'm against an auction house for Atlas because it would undermine the kind of trade environment they stated they were aiming to create, and one that I think if properly developed could be unique and engaging. So far properly developed hasn't been seen or heard from, so I'm dubious we'll get there any time soon if ever, but that is the reason for my being against AH for Atlas.

Do not by any stretch of the imagination judge Eve by Atlas. If you're not familiar with Eve, the short version is that it has by far the most complex and sophisticated game economy of any MMO out there. It is the only game which has a full time economist on staff. If you are talking about gaming economies, there is Eve, and then there is everything else. I think Grapeshot aspired to at least some of what Eve does without really understanding it or having any clear idea of how to go about creating their version of it. But dismissing something just because you're ignorant of it doesn't advance your argument, it just shows it's limitations.

And if you are holding out on supporting the damn auction house just because they said they want to be like eve then you are dense as well. Not trying to be offensive but get real. Do you think it’s rwally going to happen? They put a little damn shack that you could sell 💩 and they made a 1400 upkeep(I dgaf if they change it or not) that is your merchant/trade/economic future.

put the damn auctions house in there. Even though wow is dead so to speak the reason it is still somewhat alive is because of the auction house. People spend real hours there making money. Sure it might not be the same trade system you want but it is like a stock market.

they will NEVER be able to accomplish what they said they wanted to do. That should be evident by now.

and on that point if eve accomplished something nobody else has but yet you want atlas to be like it aren’t you as bad as I am for wanting it to be like wow.

i mean we both k ow that neither one will happen right?

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 I get your point but no.All i have to do is watch the you tube streamers bragging with their extreme builds bashing the casual tradesmen with no cannons etc to see how fun that would be for me. I used to say we should merge the servers and make the Lawles regions PvP but even that would be pretty dicey. 

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4 minutes ago, Realist said:

And if you are holding out on supporting the damn auction house just because they said they want to be like eve then you are dense as well. Not trying to be offensive but get real. Do you think it’s rwally going to happen? They put a little damn shack that you could sell 💩 and they made a 1400 upkeep(I dgaf if they change it or not) that is your merchant/trade/economic future.

put the damn auctions house in there. Even though wow is dead so to speak the reason it is still somewhat alive is because of the auction house. People spend real hours there making money. Sure it might not be the same trade system you want but it is like a stock market.

they will NEVER be able to accomplish what they said they wanted to do. That should be evident by now.

and on that point if eve accomplished something nobody else has but yet you want atlas to be like it aren’t you as bad as I am for wanting it to be like wow.

i mean we both k ow that neither one will happen right?

There are differences between what Eve does and what Atlas was looking to do, but the core idea for the purposes of our discussion was not having a central AH so that physically trading goods across the grid became part of developing the game's economy by stimulating trade routes and trading relationships between companies and even individuals. This idea still has merit and could still be developed, and just because things are going wrong now does not mean I'm going to support putting in an AH, because at that point I could just go play one of many other MMO's that have an AH and are otherwise better. The craptacular player shops are clearly not the future because they met immediate resistance from the playerbase and have already been altered. There is still a long long road of development ahead. If Atlas never makes it, so be it, I'll move on, but I'm not going to support turning Atlas into what every other MMO already has just to keep it alive. Because at that point it would just be a crappier version of already existing games.

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4 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

There are differences between what Eve does and what Atlas was looking to do, but the core idea for the purposes of our discussion was not having a central AH so that physically trading goods across the grid became part of developing the game's economy by stimulating trade routes and trading relationships between companies and even individuals. This idea still has merit and could still be developed, and just because things are going wrong now does not mean I'm going to support putting in an AH, because at that point I could just go play one of many other MMO's that have an AH and are otherwise better. The craptacular player shops are clearly not the future because they met immediate resistance from the playerbase and have already been altered. There is still a long long road of development ahead. If Atlas never makes it, so be it, I'll move on, but I'm not going to support turning Atlas into what every other MMO already has just to keep it alive. Because at that point it would just be a crappier version of already existing games.

Wow, you are actually right and I actually apologize. I was so consumed with this crap coming to console and surviving that I didn’t really care what it was. Kind of shaking my head at myself at this point.

its such bullshit though boomer. Over 3 years of their crap and then this. You like to talk about what they say they want the game to be and yet I am still stuck on what jeremy said when they announced atlas “we have changed”. That is shit.

very disappointed at this whole thing. Very disappointed 

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49 minutes ago, Realist said:

Wow, you are actually right and I actually apologize. I was so consumed with this crap coming to console and surviving that I didn’t really care what it was. Kind of shaking my head at myself at this point.

its such bullshit though boomer. Over 3 years of their crap and then this. You like to talk about what they say they want the game to be and yet I am still stuck on what jeremy said when they announced atlas “we have changed”. That is shit.

very disappointed at this whole thing. Very disappointed 

Oh you're not the only one. I still very much remember the comments about how "We learned so many lessons from Ark." I have seen little evidence that lessons learned from Ark have turned into a better game for Atlas, and quite a bit of evidence to the contrary. At this point, things are indeed disapointing. I do reference what the developers have said they want the game to be, but I'm certainly aware of the vast gulf between those statements and what we have so far. There is a long road, and much could still take shape, however the present state of the game leaves me remembering something Dr Martin Luther King Jr. said once:

"I am no longer optimistic, but I remain hopeful."

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20 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Oh you're not the only one. I still very much remember the comments about how "We learned so many lessons from Ark." I have seen little evidence that lessons learned from Ark have turned into a better game for Atlas, and quite a bit of evidence to the contrary. At this point, things are indeed disapointing. I do reference what the developers have said they want the game to be, but I'm certainly aware of the vast gulf between those statements and what we have so far. There is a long road, and much could still take shape, however the present state of the game leaves me remembering something Dr Martin Luther King Jr. said once:

"I am no longer optimistic, but I remain hopeful."

If you are as awesome as the good doctor then so be it. I am not however.

the optimism and hope is gone. I still have standards though. I will keep expecting better and better will not be good enough. There won’t be thanks that is awarded even when the standard is met because a standard is a minimal goal that is set. Once the standard is reached, that means the job was just done. There was not special circumstance or above and beyond actuon. That just means they did what they are supposed to do. When you just do your job there is no need for congratulations, after that you just move on to the next job.

anyone that congratulates them on not failing is part of the problem. 

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2 hours ago, Realist said:

 

wildcard is really stupid for going for an mmo but still trying to stay with ark.

nind you, before we go off that subject, ark was very successful regardless of bugs. Their biggest mistake was thinking they could move away from the ark setting and make a true mmo, regardless of pirates. This was an ark DLC and whoever tries to deny is an idiot 😂

 

I was thinking something like this the other day...
They are thinking too small with the game , and limiting themselves in many way because it is still Ark.
Ark is only the base...they can grow and expand so much upon that base , but they seem to just fall back on tames and creatures in a game that i feel should be focusing so much more on pirate elements and ships.
I don't think they can ever really grow until they drop the concept that its Ark 2.0 and accept it as a new game in its own right

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47 minutes ago, Derfel said:

I was thinking something like this the other day...
They are thinking too small with the game , and limiting themselves in many way because it is still Ark.
Ark is only the base...they can grow and expand so much upon that base , but they seem to just fall back on tames and creatures in a game that i feel should be focusing so much more on pirate elements and ships.
I don't think they can ever really grow until they drop the concept that its Ark 2.0 and accept it as a new game in its own right

You are very correct in the way that it is ark. And especially the ark 2.0 part.

but, this is ark and tames are very important right now.

i still firmly believe that until all aspects of the survival genre are gone, tames need to remain. Once a full mmo has been achieved only then would I be fine with tames being gone.

but yes, I do get what you are saying though

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2 hours ago, Realist said:

You are very correct in the way that it is ark. And especially the ark 2.0 part.

but, this is ark and tames are very important right now.

i still firmly believe that until all aspects of the survival genre are gone, tames need to remain. Once a full mmo has been achieved only then would I be fine with tames being gone.

but yes, I do get what you are saying though

oh im not saying lose the tames by any means..they are a vital part of the game...
just perhaps instead of adding more and more tamable creatures , consider frigates..or something new and exciting that takes it away from the ark clone mindset

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