Jump to content

grzegorz131

Again no balance. Blackjacks and liquid flame

Recommended Posts

Blackjacks should be nerfed against tames. Why? Because now 2 naked guys can kill 100% imprinted bear with 2,5k hp and 250% damage with rider on it. How? You are hitting rider and he is unmounted from bear. Next step is to hit bear time after time because he can not do anything when someone hits him. When bear is bugged you can kill it even with pickaxes. You can do the same even with crab! Nice balance devs.
 
At this moment there is no sense to breed or tame any animal because they are useless in pvp.
 
Another problem is liquid flame. It should work only on ships. All land fights with animals are based on liquid flame. IT IS PATHETIC OP.  Percentage damage is huge (around 33% per short hit). The range is huge. In addition, you can deal damage even in time of peace because the burning land also causes damage. You can kill everything only with swivel-horse with liquid flame.  Balance means the possibility of using each weapon and the effect depends mainly on the skill.
 
Currently, on land you need only blackjack if you are on foot or horse with swivel with liquid flame if you are using tames. Bears, crabs and everything else is without sense.
Edited by grzegorz131

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What do you mean, blackjakc hitting rider directly? Doesnt a melee weapon hit a tame first?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After first hit you are unmounted. It is look like hitting tame causing thid. Im not shure how it will work with lion when you can hit rider directly. Anyway it is without sense for crab or bear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can anyone else confirm that blackjacks cause dismount after one hit?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, grzegorz131 said:
Blackjacks should be nerfed against tames. Why? Because now 2 naked guys can kill 100% imprinted bear with 2,5k hp and 250% damage with rider on it. How? You are hitting rider and he is unmounted from bear. Next step is to hit bear time after time because he can not do anything when someone hits him. When bear is bugged you can kill it even with pickaxes. You can do the same even with crab! Nice balance devs.
 
At this moment there is no sense to breed or tame any animal because they are useless in pvp.
 
Another problem is liquid flame. It should work only on ships. All land fights with animals are based on liquid flame. IT IS PATHETIC OP.  Percentage damage is huge (around 33% per short hit). The range is huge. In addition, you can deal damage even in time of peace because the burning land also causes damage. You can kill everything only with swivel-horse with liquid flame.  Balance means the possibility of using each weapon and the effect depends mainly on the skill.
 
Currently, on land you need only blackjack if you are on foot or horse with swivel with liquid flame if you are using tames. Bears, crabs and everything else is without sense.

Blackjacks are OP, liquid flame on the other hand is the only defence against tames. If you remove blackjacks AND liquid flame you won't be able to kill any tames and it will lead to ARK - only tames will matter in PvP. Outside of liquid flame tames don't take much dmg ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It should be ppl vs ppl and tames vs tames. Breeding has no sense now if you can kill any bear with 2 naked guys and blackjack.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, grzegorz131 said:

It should be ppl vs ppl and tames vs tames. Breeding has no sense now if you can kill any bear with 2 naked guys and blackjack.

You can pretty much oneshot those players when they are trying to reach you. Or your co-raiders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I cant because after first hit im unmounted and my tame is frozen. Even when i able to hit them first they still are not for one bite. Ppl has hp like 250+

Edited by grzegorz131

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, grzegorz131 said:

It should be ppl vs ppl and tames vs tames. Breeding has no sense now if you can kill any bear with 2 naked guys and blackjack.

In this case I will support the nerfing of a blackjack! If it is true that it not only demounts but also freezes a tame so it can not defend itself after only one hit, this basically leads to a stunlock.

What a fucking broken game.

Liquid flame is avoidable by running into water.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would rather have to deal with liquid flame than a de mount and a tame stunlock. That thing is horrible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, gnihar said:

I would rather have to deal with liquid flame than a de mount and a tame stunlock. That thing is horrible.

It is true. We were able to fight even against liquid flame but not against blackjacks.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think OP is focusing on his tame not being able to be mounted so much ,the ones who knocked him off with the blackjack is killing him, focus on killing the player, also just whistle neutral so the tame fights the idiot hitting it with a blackjack over and over.  Use a bola to stop the blackjacker from moving, whistle neutral, and kill them. 

Tames are still too strong, raid streams that I watch are all tames, grenades and carbines. 

Guns>blackjack 

So if your on a tame, and you have guns, you should have a way to defend yourself. Even tame rider vs tame rider, the main objective is to bola the other rider. 

Edited by Mike L

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Mike L said:

I think OP is focusing on his tame not being able to be mounted so much ,the ones who knocked him off with the blackjack is killing him, focus on killing the player, also just whistle neutral so the tame fights the idiot hitting it with a blackjack over and over.  Use a bola to stop the blackjacker from moving, whistle neutral, and kill them. 

Tames are still too strong, raid streams that I watch are all tames, grenades and carbines. 

Guns>blackjack 

So if your on a tame, and you have guns, you should have a way to defend yourself. Even tame rider vs tame rider, the main objective is to bola the other rider. 

Yes that is correct, but as I understood it, a tame will be stunned eventhough it is on non passive. 

Bola is the best. Guns are obviosuly hated by devs because even a good one is useless against a 350 health legendary armor, with that damned reloading. If we had a faster firing hitscan though...like in Ark...

Edited by gnihar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

call me a bit dumb, but if blackjacks are the counter for dudes on tames (dismounting), then should the focus for the guys on tames be to take out the dudes with blackjacks first?  Sounds to me like a great circle of strategy is needed. 

Tames > people

Blackjacks > tames

People > blackjacks

There's a whole load of rock / paper / scissors going on here, isn't it easier to intel your enemy, and if all they have is rocks, then don't send in all your scissors!?    Maybe I'm being too simple...  who knows.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Vorxius said:

call me a bit dumb, but if blackjacks are the counter for dudes on tames (dismounting), then should the focus for the guys on tames be to take out the dudes with blackjacks first?  Sounds to me like a great circle of strategy is needed. 

Tames > people

Blackjacks > tames

People > blackjacks

There's a whole load of rock / paper / scissors going on here, isn't it easier to intel your enemy, and if all they have is rocks, then don't send in all your scissors!?    Maybe I'm being too simple...  who knows.

 

Problem is there is a huge discrepancy between the involved "costs". A naked with a blackjack isn't a huge commitment. Besides that that whole system isn't really fun or interesting for anyone.

I would like to see tames nerfed and make people on foot (or as real mounted soldiers, not this swivel bs) a lot stronger but "use blackjack as counter to tames" is just as stupid as tames themselves. It's fighting cancer with cholera.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, LinkesAuge said:

It's fighting cancer with cholera

An interesting way to put it!   Somehow makes sense, even though I'm like:

tenor.gif?itemid=10313644

 

+1, quote of the day  🙂

Can't you just take out naked guys with carbines from long distance?  Thought without armour mitigation, that a naked dude is just carbine food......

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Vorxius said:

An interesting way to put it!   Somehow makes sense, even though I'm like:

tenor.gif?itemid=10313644

 

+1, quote of the day  🙂

Can't you just take out naked guys with carbines from long distance?  Thought without armour mitigation, that a naked dude is just carbine food......

 

 

 

Sure, you can but then he respawns and hardly lost anything. There is also the issue that currently carbines become near useless when in bigger fights due to extreme lag (down to not even being able to reload the weapon) and making the cheap "run with blackjack at enemy" strategy even better.

But like I said my main concern isn't even "balance" (you could find the right values/costs for that although it will always be a brittle balance due to all the factors involved, especially regarding tames), it's that it simply doesn't feel good/rewarding and is kind of nonsensical on top.

Imo the whole land PvP needs a total redesign. From the way guns are handled/used to the role tames play (and with "play" I mean totally dominate it).

As long as that's not the case other issues will continue to crop up because there is just no solid foundation (which is why for example explosive barrels, grenades etc go through so many changes).

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, LinkesAuge said:

Sure, you can but then he respawns and hardly lost anything

Would diminishing returns solve this on bed use?  So each boat is limited to number of beds.  So perhaps there's a 15 minute cooldown from when a bed is placed before it can be used.. and, when a bed is used, the timer multiplies by 50%.  If an enemy attacks they have an increasing period of time to wait before being able to bedspawn, and, an enemy can't just exploit new beds because of the 15 min timer..  eventually one side or the other, is going to run out of bed spawning timers..... so the 50 guys running about naked are going to find themselves bitch-slapped by 3 / 4 / 5 minute respawn timers on their beds, so it's in their best interest not to die... so they won't just run about naked to get one shot by snipers with carbines...    This would give the advantage to the defenders anyway, as they could have so many effective beds that they're not encumbered as much by diminishing returns on bed timers....   

Attackers have to come prepared, intel at a high, know their target, and use bed spawns sparingly, which means no daft suicide runs, which pointlessly increases timers on beds each time.

Naked combat is the daft aspect for me...  I can't remember the vikings attacking the english naked  !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You couldn't be more right Greg. This game's PvP is absolutely disgusting when you really analyze the PvP experience on a bigger scale. I've realized this game really is all about which mega tribe has more geeks online at lvl 100 or more with 300+ health (not counting insane armor) TANKING everything. You can only tickle them.. The name of the game now is fly around, grenade the NPC's, mortars, puckles, etc... tank many shots, and still fly/swim away very easily no problem. Tames can swim away way too easily as well. It's too much about who's liquid flame bear or horse survives and goes on to fight longer to kill more enemy tames. Think about it, two tames running around in a laggy fps dropping terd show, trying to get a skill-less flamethrower shot off on one another. Sadly that's what shapes the overall fight. Then of course you have guns that are absolutely WORTHLESS, couldn't emphasis this more. When people get to high levels, guns and melee weapons barely make a scratch! The broken af purchasable drakes and fire elementals deserve a mention as well. So you have all that garbage going on, and then the cherry on top is the MASSIVE LAG / SHIT servers and FPS drop. Especially during big raids... omg. After you've experienced all that, you're just about ready to uninstall and wish this game a happy death.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, rickyr0llin said:

You couldn't be more right Greg. This game's PvP is absolutely disgusting when you really analyze the PvP experience on a bigger scale. I've realized this game really is all about which mega tribe has more geeks online at lvl 100 or more with 300+ health (not counting insane armor) TANKING everything. You can only tickle them.. The name of the game now is fly around, grenade the NPC's, mortars, puckles, etc... tank many shots, and still fly/swim away very easily no problem. Tames can swim away way too easily as well. It's too much about who's liquid flame bear or horse survives and goes on to fight longer to kill more enemy tames. Think about it, two tames running around in a laggy fps dropping terd show, trying to get a skill-less flamethrower shot off on one another. Sadly that's what shapes the overall fight. Then of course you have guns that are absolutely WORTHLESS, couldn't emphasis this more. When people get to high levels, guns and melee weapons barely make a scratch! The broken af purchasable drakes and fire elementals deserve a mention as well. So you have all that garbage going on, and then the cherry on top is the MASSIVE LAG / SHIT servers and FPS drop. Especially during big raids... omg. After you've experienced all that, you're just about ready to uninstall and wish this game a happy death.

You know what is funny part? That you can have 2 people lvl 40 and easy kill guy on 100% imprinted bear with 2,5k hp and 220% dmg only with one sword and one blackjack

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/30/2019 at 1:59 AM, rickyr0llin said:

You couldn't be more right Greg. This game's PvP is absolutely disgusting when you really analyze the PvP experience on a bigger scale. I've realized this game really is all about which mega tribe has more geeks online at lvl 100 or more with 300+ health (not counting insane armor) TANKING everything. You can only tickle them.. The name of the game now is fly around, grenade the NPC's, mortars, puckles, etc... tank many shots, and still fly/swim away very easily no problem. Tames can swim away way too easily as well. It's too much about who's liquid flame bear or horse survives and goes on to fight longer to kill more enemy tames. Think about it, two tames running around in a laggy fps dropping terd show, trying to get a skill-less flamethrower shot off on one another. Sadly that's what shapes the overall fight. Then of course you have guns that are absolutely WORTHLESS, couldn't emphasis this more. When people get to high levels, guns and melee weapons barely make a scratch! The broken af purchasable drakes and fire elementals deserve a mention as well. So you have all that garbage going on, and then the cherry on top is the MASSIVE LAG / SHIT servers and FPS drop. Especially during big raids... omg. After you've experienced all that, you're just about ready to uninstall and wish this game a happy death.

That is exactly why I always advocated ultra powerful puckles. Their armor penetration and damage output need to be doubled, and an option to reload automatically when less than 5 shots and inactive for 1 min is added.

So, want to fly around grenading? Sure but have 500 hp AND mythical armor and even then they could die and lose the gear 🙂

Edited by gnihar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Or we could just re-balance health, armor, etc.  I agree with Ricky  in that the game needs some serious re-work in regards to that.  I prefer PvP thats purely skill based over PvP that puts a heavy emphasis on levels.  I'd be happy with health being static for all.  When you level you get skill points for learning and improving things like stamina, int, weight, etc.  Leave health out of it.  I'd be content with that and armor sets being toned back a bit on damage reduction.  Large health pools with high end armor is redonkulous. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

Or we could just re-balance health, armor, etc.  I agree with Ricky  in that the game needs some serious re-work in regards to that.  I prefer PvP thats purely skill based over PvP that puts a heavy emphasis on levels.  I'd be happy with health being static for all.  When you level you get skill points for learning and improving things like stamina, int, weight, etc.  Leave health out of it.  I'd be content with that and armor sets being toned back a bit on damage reduction.  Large health pools with high end armor is redonkulous. 

Agreed. Skill should be the biggest factor. Different gear sets should have different attributes that work both positively and negativley ( heavy armour reduces movement speed, but reduces incoming damage etc so you can mix and match to create a balanced gear set for your playstyle ie; heavy gloves, light chest piece, hide pants etc) 

If the devs took a look at melee damage i think ship boardings may become more popular aswell. Atm its kinda a last ditch option when you run outta planks. It works but only because no one expects it usually. Id like ship claiming to take alot less time at sea aswell. This will lead to less players simply trying to sink anyone in combat and maybe get some good pvp during ship claim contesting. The claiming of anything anchored should still take a long long time tho.

Good ideas tho Doc. I even think a small company with better players should be able to take on megas to a degree on a fairer playing field. Im in a large company atm but i still want everyone to have a good time regardless of company size.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...