Good changes, but a choice needs to be made

[Realist 504]

There were actually some good changes that were made during this last update. The thing is the changes weren’t drastic enough. This is the time to make a really big choice. Either get rid of the survival aspect of get rid of the mmo aspect. Yes mmo really only means a lot of people on one map but other parts come with that  You guys will end up failing if you trying to do both.

there will never be an economy or government if you stick with the survival aspect. If I were to give you my opinion on what to choose it would be to get rid of the survival aspect of the game completely and totally.

you might disagree but this is still very much ark. It is still build a base, build a boat and go raid people.

and with companies instead of factions I see very little that isn’t just ark survival evolved.

the update did bring in slightly more players than i thought but the peak before the wipe was announced was 25k and the peak now is 12k with this weekend peaking at 11k already.

so yes this updated and the changes increased the numbers by 10k during the wipe phase but it only brought back half of the people from before the wipe.

not dumping on you guys for wiping by the way. It was a needed choice of course. The changes needing to be more drastic though.

even though I think companies in general needed to be eliminated, if your choice is to keep them you need to make them as small as possible. If people really want big groups then do factions. Even if you aren’t part of the same group and don’t play together? Who cares, you are in the same factions. At the very least it would enable a LFG function to where people from the same factions could group up to accomplish certain goals. The other good news is they couldn’t be betrayed because they would be in the same faction.

 

so he is my half compliment half realization. You guys have been doing a very good job getting more communication out there and I will applaud you for showing you do care by trying to make this big changes. That you have done a good job on.

as far as the actual decisions go, or lack intensity of those changes this is where the  compliment ends. If you are not looking at the big picture you see the numbers went up from the 2k to the 11k it currently is, which is true small picture. Big picture is a different story. In all reality they have lost half of their playerbase since the wipe was announced. You can look at 2 up to 12 all you want. But it is really 25 down to 12.

so to end it, time to choose. Mmo or survival. Both will be a fail

 

[Captain Stabbin 34]

Another wipe is going to happen you can bank on that.  People need to stop crying about it as this is EA!

 

And to the idea of no survival then what’s the point!  I say get rid of stupid vitamin deficiency as that is a totally useless game mechanic!  If anything only make it happen when out on the sea by ship.

[Realist 504]

3 minutes ago, Captain Stabbin said:

Another wipe is going to happen you can bank on that.  People need to stop crying about it as this is EA!

 

And to the idea of no survival then what’s the point!  I say get rid of stupid vitamin deficiency as that is a totally useless game mechanic!  If anything only make it happen when out on the sea by ship.

I wasn’t complaint about the wipe in any way shape or form lol.

the point would be playing an mmo. Food, water and vitamins is actually pretty old that doesn’t really give any inmersion factor especially when you just kill yourself when you are close to your bed. It’s just a chore. It’s not realistic in the slightest. 

[Captain Stabbin 34]

51 minutes ago, Realist said:

I wasn’t complaint about the wipe in any way shape or form lol.

the point would be playing an mmo. Food, water and vitamins is actually pretty old that doesn’t really give any inmersion factor especially when you just kill yourself when you are close to your bed. It’s just a chore. It’s not realistic in the slightest. 

Oh I meant people in general not you specifically!

[Sulfurblade 194]

Certainly not a fan of the food and vitamin system in game never have been!

However, I agree and don't with you realist...

What I agree with is they need to definately focus on the MMORPG aspects of the game!

But I don't see Survival and MMORPG as seperate things.....  This game really is not that far off of SWG or Ultima Online from the perspective of being a Sandbox MMORPG!  

Whats different is we have a generation of gamers who have been trained with (Carebear PVE  / Hardcore ask question's Latter PvP) And everything inbetween is gone!  Because the MMORPG genre has catered to separating the groups for too long!

 

I think that Atlas has a great backbone to become a great Sandbox MMORPG, but as I have said in other threads they need to work on mechanic's that bring the community together!

Law and Order, Factions, Government etc

 

 

[Realist 504]

1 hour ago, Sulfurblade said:

Certainly not a fan of the food and vitamin system in game never have been!

However, I agree and don't with you realist...

What I agree with is they need to definately focus on the MMORPG aspects of the game!

But I don't see Survival and MMORPG as seperate things.....  This game really is not that far off of SWG or Ultima Online from the perspective of being a Sandbox MMORPG!  

Whats different is we have a generation of gamers who have been trained with (Carebear PVE  / Hardcore ask question's Latter PvP) And everything inbetween is gone!  Because the MMORPG genre has catered to separating the groups for too long!

 

I think that Atlas has a great backbone to become a great Sandbox MMORPG, but as I have said in other threads they need to work on mechanic's that bring the community together!

Law and Order, Factions, Government etc

 

 

Totally agree with you on almost everything except the whole survival and mmo being together.

that whole food, water, etc. part you don’t like is the main ingredient for a survival game. If just trying not to get killed makes it survival then every game is a survival game.

ok and let’s take a step back. Let’s say that survival and mmo would work. It won’t be able to with this game. I get it, some have but this one won’t. Ark had a HUGE emphasis on survival and that is what they are used to. They aren’t going to be able to add a perfect blend of the two. They just won’t. Can they make this game good? Hell, sure they can. They are making bad decisions though. They will not find a perfect medium for atlas. 

As far as the differences go you are completely spot on. Couldn’t disagree in the slightest. Here we have our problem and here we have the impossibility that I talked about above.

the one thing I recently told ced is that they really have to learn to make changes to pvp only and pve only. Of course he liked the idea, the problem is that is more work and more money. If they want the same success that ark had for atlas they will definitely need to make the decision to suck it up and make that choice.

it doesn’t matter if the game is good or not, because it isn’t great. Ark was broken as hell in the beginning but it was a success from the beginning. They went about things very wrong with atlas and not only has it shown but still shows and will continue to show until the drastic decisions are made.

to me there is no point in catering to the existing players. They need a new front to come in and drastic changes are needed for that. Never been a fan of people saying they are loyal players because in all reality that doesn’t really mean anything and it hurts a business when they listen to them.

 

[Kveldulf 32]

33 minutes ago, Realist said:

to me there is no point in catering to the existing players. They need a new front to come in and drastic changes are needed for that. Never been a fan of people saying they are loyal players because in all reality that doesn’t really mean anything and it hurts a business when they listen to them.

Ok.  But do you think they should maybe listen to people who have actually experienced the system/mechanic you summarily want to just remove entirely?

A survival aspect will not stop the kinds of player institutions you want to see.  Not in the least.  It's just not that drastic.  It's not going to stifle social evolution.

On the contrary, the institutionally minded players you want to focus on will organize far beyond the trifle of basic survival.  It's a good mechanic for small bands of explorers to contend with, for lone wolves to conquer.

It doesn't need removal, at all.  On the contrary.  It may well prove a catalyst for what you want to see, in some situations.

Regarding the numbers.  You were in here a mere few hours after patch launched with doomsday numbers.  Big picture doesn't mean you take a myopic outlook and make it bigger.  That's still myopic, just with thicker glasses.

[Realist 504]

41 minutes ago, Kveldulf said:

Ok.  But do you think they should maybe listen to people who have actually experienced the system/mechanic you summarily want to just remove entirely?

A survival aspect will not stop the kinds of player institutions you want to see.  Not in the least.  It's just not that drastic.  It's not going to stifle social evolution.

On the contrary, the institutionally minded players you want to focus on will organize far beyond the trifle of basic survival.  It's a good mechanic for small bands of explorers to contend with, for lone wolves to conquer.

It doesn't need removal, at all.  On the contrary.  It may well prove a catalyst for what you want to see, in some situations.

Regarding the numbers.  You were in here a mere few hours after patch launched with doomsday numbers.  Big picture doesn't mean you take a myopic outlook and make it bigger.  That's still myopic, just with thicker glasses.

I’ll try to go by paragraphs here. 

First paragraph, no not really. I don’t think they should listen to what the existing players want because that is why they are in the shape they are in. It isn’t just a few hours into the update. This has shown 2 weekends into the update. The first initial weekend will always have the highest numbers. This weekend is less then last weekend.

Second paragraph. It already has. Megas wanted to be who they were and we just saw the death of empire servers. It didn’t work. With the upgrade to 75 player companies will bring new problems so more changes will take place. The survival aspect will just make it worse. Regardless of multi tasking and the grind needed for right now you will never see people wanting to waste their time with government or an economy because they are busy worrying about other things like survival.

paragraph 3, that is not going to happen man. They will never rise above the typical mega mentality. If it was possible it would have already happened. Even with colonies you still see the whole mega racket going on. If they are willing to go against the rules then no change will be made. That one is pretty simple.

Paragraph 4, nope, survival needs to leave in this game in order for it to meet its potential. This could be an awesome pirate game but they have tried to “gender blend” this game to a ridiculous point. It will never meet its full potential with what they are doing. You say catalyst, I say handicap.

5th paragraph, man, the whole “doomsday” thing is crap to begin with. That suggests I am saying the game is dying very soon. I never said that so using that word makes no sense. I said their decisions were bad. Big difference. And yes the numbers show that. Ok man, I tell you what, you give me the “golden ticket” reason why even though so many changes were done that it is still 50% below what is was before the wipe. So what is it is besides a bad decision?

 

[Kidori 143]

Well the reasons for the population decline are numerous and can't be linked back to any one reason.

Firstly this game has never recovered from the poor reputation and reviews it got because of the issues on launch day. You go to the comments section of any Atlas article on any PC gaming news site like PCGamer or Rock Paper Shotgun and you'll just see people trashing the game, almost all of whom have never played beyond the refund window on launch day, and anyone defending the game is automatically wrong and labeled a shill. Couple that with some unflattering YouTube videos and the mostly negative Steam reviews and you have very few new people joining.

Then you have a large number of people that bought the game, played for a while and realized that the game wasn't what they thought it was. There's a lot of people out there that don't really "get" the game, and that's due in large part to a big difference in how the developers marketed the game and how it was marketed by third-party sources.

There's also a crowd that come in just to check the game out but are waiting until full release to actually play. The PC gaming landscape has changed a lot since ARK came out and a lot of people have been burned one too many times by early access games and either won't touch them until release or only jump in once in a while to check out updates.

The biggest drop in player count was due to the premature wipe announcement, and is something I hope they don't repeat but have a feeling they will.

And then you have the people that played the game, did everything they wanted to and got bored and moved on to another game who may or may not check the game out again at release.

But there are also a lot of people that have left because of bugs, or griefers, or bad design decisions, etc. It's hard to nail down exactly how many people have left for each cause, but it's certainly a mix of reasons and not just one.

Edited April 22, 2019 by Kidori

[Realist 504]

56 minutes ago, Kidori said:

Well the reasons for the population decline are numerous and can't be linked back to any one reason.

Firstly this game has never recovered from the poor reputation and reviews it got because of the issues on launch day. You go to the comments section of any Atlas article on any PC gaming news site like PCGamer or Rock Paper Shotgun and you'll just see people trashing the game, almost all of whom have never played beyond the refund window on launch day, and anyone defending the game is automatically wrong and labeled a shill. Couple that with some unflattering YouTube videos and the mostly negative Steam reviews and you have very few new people joining.

Then you have a large number of people that bought the game, played for a while and realized that the game wasn't what they thought it was. There's a lot of people out there that don't really "get" the game, and that's due in large part to a big difference in how the developers marketed the game and how it was marketed by third-party sources.

There's also a crowd that come in just to check the game out but are waiting until full release to actually play. The PC gaming landscape has changed a lot since ARK came out and a lot of people have been burned one too many times by early access games and either won't touch them until release or only jump in once in a while to check out updates.

The biggest drop in player count was due to the premature wipe announcement, and is something I hope they don't repeat but have a feeling they will.

And then you have the people that played the game, did everything they wanted to and got bored and moved on to another game who may or may not check the game out again at release.

But there are also a lot of people that have left because of bugs, or griefers, or bad design decisions, etc. It's hard to nail down exactly how many people have left for each cause, but it's certainly a mix of reasons and not just one.

Sorry, but that is not true. The biggest dro in playerbase came from the the game being released in that state it was in. It went from close to 59k to low 25k before the wipe was announced. After it got announced it dropped to 9k as far as peaks go. The wipe announcement actually had a smaller drop in numbers than before.

from what you said there were people that didn’t want to bother with the release and people that didn’t want to bother with the wipe. The one thing you aren’t thinking about is with all these changes.... why haven’t they come back? The answer is simple. They have a faulty design and the game isn’t nearly as good as it should be. That is the answer. They need a total rehaul. Not of the claim system but of the whole game.

yeah I know some of these well wishers think after the “great release” in a year and a half there will be this high amount of. Umbers coming in... do you actually believe that? With all the hype this game had, you don’t see that whoever was going to buy it already bought it?

nah man, the only way to get people to buy this game is to change it completely. And I mean to the extent that it is no longer the game that others played at all.

[Kidori 143]

Oh I wasn't disagreeing with you, just pointing out that there's more than one reason the population has been decreasing. Can't really point the finger at any one thing, the game has plenty of different things going against it.

I do think the game needs a proper overhaul, and I also think factions are the best direction for the game to go in. It would solve a lot of the game's issues, and the developers seem to want to have a place for both large and small companies and have them working and living together and the only way I can see that happening is with a faction system. I had written a long-winded suggestion for it months ago but the wipe announcement and claim system kind of dominated the conversation.

Edited April 22, 2019 by Kidori

[wintericem107 8]

or they have came back because they only got this game wanting for d2 to come out and now that it has there their. if you watch game numbers you see that there a wave of players who buy the biggest thing out play fopr a month then buy then next big thing

I also would like a faction thing could be what this gaem needs, or not im not a game maker so I don't know how to play with the lazy players who only want to pvp and not put any grinding hours in 

[Realist 504]

27 minutes ago, Kidori said:

Oh I wasn't disagreeing with you, just pointing out that there's more than one reason the population has been decreasing. Can't really point the finger at any one thing, the game has plenty of different things going against it.

I do think the game needs a proper overhaul, and I also think factions are the best direction for the game to go in. It would solve a lot of the game's issues, and the developers seem to want to have a place for both large and small companies and have them working and living together and the only way I can see that happening is with a faction system. I had written a long-winded suggestion for it months ago but the wipe announcement and claim system kind of dominated the conversation.

Very cool man, can’t diagree at all. If you can find that thread copy it here. I would like to read your suggestion. Yeah factions just need to happen. Even with the claim system to be honest. Could easily bring in a LFG tool if that happened. Could actually make the smaller guys happy at the same time.

lets see if they are smart enough to do that.

[Realist 504]

24 minutes ago, wintericem107 said:

or they have came back because they only got this game wanting for d2 to come out and now that it has there their. if you watch game numbers you see that there a wave of players who buy the biggest thing out play fopr a month then buy then next big thing

I also would like a faction thing could be what this gaem needs, or not im not a game maker so I don't know how to play with the lazy players who only want to pvp and not put any grinding hours in 

Hell yeah man, factions are definitely the way to go.

but believe me, I still love the grind. I can actually go 8 hours of nothing but stone if I get the chance. No biggie at all. 

Really hoping they bring factions into play. I’ll keep pressing them on it on Twitter.

[Kidori 143]

28 minutes ago, Realist said:

Very cool man, can’t diagree at all. If you can find that thread copy it here. I would like to read your suggestion. Yeah factions just need to happen. Even with the claim system to be honest. Could easily bring in a LFG tool if that happened. Could actually make the smaller guys happy at the same time.

lets see if they are smart enough to do that.

 

Quote

What if the game had factions implemented. A lot of other MMOs and other games have used the system to great effect and I think Atlas may be a perfect place for it. 

When people create their characters they're prompted to choose a faction to join. There could be several different factions and each one could have their own unique structure and ship aesthetics, and you could even go so far as to give each faction their own benefits. 

For example, you could have a faction described as warring nomads that get increased weapon damage and ship speed but increased structure cost and upkeep. A faction described as being great builders could get cheaper stone structures and upkeep but lower seafaring abilities. A neutral Merchant's Guild faction could have reduced upkeep and could build on any faction's land and set up player shops outside of Freeports but could never own their own land. The pirate faction could get higher gold gains, be better at ship to ship combat and sail faster but could only build in lawless areas. 

The factions and pros/cons of each can be different, I'm just using those as examples. But several different factions could exist and islands could be claimed for that faction rather than individual companies within those factions. 

Then we can have elections once a month to choose a governor. The original governor of the island would be whichever company put the claim down first, then the company can assign a duke/duchess for each island they own. Everyone could choose to be a citizen of one island at a time, they can change their citizenship at any time but only people that are citizens of the island for at least three weeks could vote in the next election. The governor would get the benefit of taxes but would be tasked with essentially being the admin of that island. 

For PvP servers could do the same thing but if another faction takes control of the island the residents could choose to either assimilate into their faction or pack up and leave. Basically, join us or die.

I would see such a system opening up a lot of trade to get different aesthetics for building parts, everyone would have a sense of belonging to something bigger than themselves while still being able to do their own thing or play solo if they wanted to. That's a good thing as it helps distance the game more from ARK and its mentality.

Large companies could build their empires, and small companies and solo players would have their places as well and the system would hopefully be able to manage itself. 

It would also open up the door for a lot more types of content, such as faction missions, NPC towns for each faction, wars in PvP would be bigger, more drawn-out and more organized, and people would have a reason to have alt accounts in different factions so Grapeshot would benefit from the extra revenue in exchange for the amount of time and effort such a system would take to build.

The system we have now feels like a placeholder to me, just testing out the island ownership concept and the kinds of issues they're going to run into with it. They had announced the mega update too early and didn't have enough time to make the kind of drastic changes required to properly see their vision come to fruition. They kept people waiting far longer than they were comfortable with and they needed something functional to roll out.

They've already announced their next mega-update so it kind of solidifies the theory. That it's months down the line suggests to me that they're trying to give themselves plenty of time to make drastic alterations. Looking forward to the next captain's log where they give some more details on those changes.

[Konvar 24]

 

Analyze it! - 50% for two weeks.(December 22 - January 7)

Month to play the new game?

Players escaped after a week!

Beginners have no place in the game - so wipe! ( this is still - 50%)

The developer does not make 1flag = 1 player. So ask 90% of the players (50 thousand left 5 thousand).

Is someone paying for this experiment? We are waiting for a new wipe in the summer ...

P.S. Make a vote in a month, colonies or restriction of flags?

Edited April 22, 2019 by Konvar

[wintericem107 8]

most of the ppl I knew who stop sfter the first two weeks stop because they though this wasa muiltplay black flag and when the relieazed it wasn't the say meh and left. survilal games are always super hyped then dye off fast look at ark you couldn't even log in to 99 percent of the server when it cam out two later 10 to 15 in each. these game are not really ment for the mass who r looking for a pure plug and play pvp game.

[Realist 504]

16 hours ago, wintericem107 said:

most of the ppl I knew who stop sfter the first two weeks stop because they though this wasa muiltplay black flag and when the relieazed it wasn't the say meh and left. survilal games are always super hyped then dye off fast look at ark you couldn't even log in to 99 percent of the server when it cam out two later 10 to 15 in each. these game are not really ment for the mass who r looking for a pure plug and play pvp game.

You can’t really say that about ark though. It’s basically the most successful survival game regardless of the bugs. That is not a good example in this point.

believe me ark had and still has tons of problems but ark makes atlas look like a 5 year old made it.

they are just making some really bad decisions but they will realize soon that the survival aspect needs to leave if they are going to bother making it an mmo. That isn’t even up for debate. They have to do it. 

By me saying that I am saying sure “who cares if the ones already here leave” they can easily get others to come in if they completely revamp the whole game. No I don’t mean claims, I mean the whole game. Easy to do in the 2 year early access period 

[ButtPirate 50]

You guys do realize REALIST does not own this game.. Has never played this game.. All she does is gives "her opinion" on shit she does not know.

She has 1500 post about how this games sucks, how this game is dying, how the devs should listen to her.   

She would argue with a dog about the correct posture it should have while shitting. 

 

[Jeheil 17]

On 4/22/2019 at 5:40 AM, Sulfurblade said:

Certainly not a fan of the food and vitamin system in game never have been!

However, I agree and don't with you realist...

What I agree with is they need to definately focus on the MMORPG aspects of the game!

But I don't see Survival and MMORPG as seperate things.....  This game really is not that far off of SWG or Ultima Online from the perspective of being a Sandbox MMORPG!  

Whats different is we have a generation of gamers who have been trained with (Carebear PVE  / Hardcore ask question's Latter PvP) And everything inbetween is gone!  Because the MMORPG genre has catered to separating the groups for too long!

 

I think that Atlas has a great backbone to become a great Sandbox MMORPG, but as I have said in other threads they need to work on mechanic's that bring the community together!

Law and Order, Factions, Government etc

 

 

This. Thanks for saving me the typing.

I like atlas as its a blend between survival and MMORPG...which is HARD and BRUTAL and requites a playerbase (not just ships) with resilience.

[Realist 504]

57 minutes ago, ButtPirate said:

You guys do realize REALIST does not own this game.. Has never played this game.. All she does is gives "her opinion" on shit she does not know.

She has 1500 post about how this games sucks, how this game is dying, how the devs should listen to her.   

She would argue with a dog about the correct posture it should have while shitting. 

 

Starting to think this is a duplicate account.

are you trying to be insulting by calling me a she? I don’t have any problem with women but you seem to want to use them as an insult. 

I know you are trying to shout on the rooftops about me not owning the game or having a certain amount of posts but do you think that is really getting you anywhere? 

You realize that everyone already knows this by now right? Lmao 

kind of old news by now

[Grongash 201]

This forum needs to check if you actually own the game.

[Bolognapwny 137]

You kids have good ideas then you start spouting your typical nonsense.... ugh...

 

One the survival element in this game is there because its part of their core programming.... They made all these dumb recipes and stuff that go into it... and they don't feel like cutting off their nose to spite their face... even though they should... Atlas is not a SURVIVAL MMO... ATLAS IS NOT A SURVIVAL MMO.... Say it again in your heads dev.

Atlas most glaring issue is that it has NO IDENTITY except for they maybe kind of want to be pirate themed... (LMFAO)

You've split your players into 50 million categories and you need people to be on one map so it feels populated... no one... NO ONE wants to play a game that FEELS dead... just because some parts of hte map have conflict going on doesn't mean the others do... 

1.) Atlas needs to find its Identity... and move forward with a singular group of gamers in mind.

2.) Look how much money you are making from private servers... is it worth it?  Keep them... scrap PVE servers.... Are they not worth it?  Scrap them and scrap PVE servers.

3.) Remove all survival elements from the game.

4.) Make cannons fit in gun ports only; make a new type of cannon that has number limit that can go on top deck.. ( you might need to do actual research on what ships used back in the days)

5.) All ghost ships redesigned to be colonial war ships... (because they fight pirates, and it makes more sense)

6.) Make some NPC factions... This way your pvers can join one of these shitter factions and be protected and live in their areas to build their RP houses... or commence trade with other factions... and ofcourse pirate factions... (look at Arch Age)

These are just a few things you can work on that would help the game a lot.... listen to it or don't listen to it... honestly this game has until WoW classic comes out... and im deleting it off my hard drive... and I know for a fact I aint the only one.

This game needs to worry about palyerbase right now... because you are not going to get anymore players than you have now... Ark only saw an increase when it launched on Consoles... just remember that.

[Jack Shandy 242]

44 minutes ago, Bolognapwny said:

This game needs to worry about palyerbase right now

 

44 minutes ago, Bolognapwny said:

scrap PVE servers

you do brighten my day with your drivel.

[Uffda Pal 0]

I totally agree. I have not seen anybody in the game actually use the "survivor" aspect of the game. I certainly dont. Just kill yourself and move on. It is a major inconvenience and adds no  depth or realism to the game in any way. Keep the different types of food you can farm to eat for small little buffs though, change them a bit maybe, and add more possibly. Ark was the exact same way, and never changed though unfortunately (and we all know this is literally pirate "kind of" ark). It is a tag they want to have on the game, and therefore have to have some small arbitrary aspect of he game associated with the tag wether it makes sense or not (i assume they think it makes the game sound more appealing "Atlas the open world survival mmorpg".

Edited April 23, 2019 by Uffda Pal