So the Megas are determined to circumvent the rules, and thus, kill this game?

[Percieval 1,067]

14 minutes ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

ARK had super large teams.  MegaTribes, they were called.

I am not asking that they destroy large companies.  I am asking, for the good of the game, for the Mega Companies to be on one server, and the smaller companies to be on another.  I DO NOT find it hilarious that the Megas seem OK with running off many smaller companies, and the game getting a reputation that if you are not in a Mega, you can forget it.  This is where we are headed.  I saw a lot of interest when the Colonies and Empires servers were announced.  When it came out that the Megas were going to follow the smaller companies to Colonies, a lot of that interest has died.  So the Megas say it is because they want the rules of Colonies.  Fine, change Empires to have those rules, minus the rules that limit company size.

We have a chance to get people back, but when they come back, and they realize that the Megas are still ruling the map by getting around the company member limit, they will leave and never come back.  This is where the Megas need to do the right thing, for the game.

Good luck with that though. Mega’s thinking about a game’s feature has never been a thing in the past. 

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

Which is why the Devs should limit the number of people in an Alliance to something like 80, and only allow one Alliance, not two.  Think about how this system they are talking about will work.  I could literally have an 800 man Company, still working together.  So you would divide into groups of 200.  You have 50 fighters in each Alliance, and they would all be in one company.  So then the 50 man fighter companies would also join together in a 200 man fighting alliance.   This group, this Mega will rule just as they ruled before, and people will leave and never come back, no matter what an update promises, because this update, with the Colonies, and Empires was supposed to give the little guy a chance.  When it doesn't, he is gone for good.

Edited April 2, 2019 by Captain Jack Shadow

[Willard 245]

31 minutes ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

Which is why the Devs should limit the number of people in an Alliance to something like 80, and only allow one Alliance, not two.  Think about how this system they are talking about will work.  I could literally have an 800 man Company, still working together.  So you would divide into groups of 200.  You have 50 fighters in each Alliance, and they would all be in one company.  So then the 50 man fighter companies would also join together in a 200 man fighting alliance.   This group, this Mega will rule just as they ruled before, and people will leave and never come back, no matter what an update promises, because this update, with the Colonies, and Empires was supposed to give the little guy a chance.  When it doesn't, he is gone for good.

They will cooperate anyway. You can delete alliances but still they will play together. Idk man, they don't see tags but they can still wear lets say blue coloured armor

You can ofc make it harder for those Megas to cooperate but you will make it harder for small companies too. This simply has no solution. Every game where you got companies/guilds, the game which supports playing in groups, will be easier for bigger groups. Its an MMO after all. 

Megas won't be such a problem anymore. There will be many more smaller companies which joined Mega on old system because they were unable to play 24/7 and cover those offline griefs/raids. This won't be such a problem on new system where everyone will be able to set a raid window according to their needs.

Lets see.

[Amy3 33]

The last few pages of this thread are a goofy pipe dream. A game company is not going to spend valuable resources "moderating" which groups have more friends than they are allowed to have. Sorry guys you have too many friends, please eliminate three. No.

Also, even if they did, the moment a group gets suspended or banned for the crime of attacking an island in an MMO about attacking islands is the moment they ignite a horrible PR fiasco of their own making that they would have a lot of difficulty escaping.

[gnihar 111]

49 minutes ago, Amy3 said:

The last few pages of this thread are a goofy pipe dream. A game company is not going to spend valuable resources "moderating" which groups have more friends than they are allowed to have. Sorry guys you have too many friends, please eliminate three. No.

Also, even if they did, the moment a group gets suspended or banned for the crime of attacking an island in an MMO about attacking islands is the moment they ignite a horrible PR fiasco of their own making that they would have a lot of difficulty escaping.

Rules are rules. If players are wiped because circumventing them, no one would raise a PR campaign to save them. In fact, I would praise th edevs for curbing the zerg so small tribes can breathe. This is not a “H.O.D. Vs Wildcard” situation.

[Jack Shandy 242]

53 minutes ago, Amy3 said:

The last few pages of this thread are a goofy pipe dream. A game company is not going to spend valuable resources "moderating" which groups have more friends than they are allowed to have. Sorry guys you have too many friends, please eliminate three. No.

Also, even if they did, the moment a group gets suspended or banned for the crime of attacking an island in an MMO about attacking islands is the moment they ignite a horrible PR fiasco of their own making that they would have a lot of difficulty escaping.

If these groups are turning people away from thier game, ie. affecting thier revenue. why would they not?

If those rules are in the Terms & Conditions, There can be no PR fiasco, well maybe about people not being able to read.

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

Not to mention the fact that they have already started down this road.  In the beginning, was there even a limit?  I know at some point, it was 500, then went to 250, and now on the Colonies server, it will be 50.  The reasonable situation is for there to be two servers, one with limits and one without.  They did that, but it seems that the Megas wanted the rules implemented on Colonies, except the member and alliance limits, so the obvious fix is to have the limits even more strict on Colonies, but add the Colonies rules that the Megas want, to the Empires server.  This seems obvious...have a meeting with the Megas again, and ask them which of the rules they like, and which they do not like, and make the Empires server to meet their needs.

The present course appears to be a fiasco.  We know the Megas are coming to the Colonies server, so many are not going to play, and those that do, are going to be hyper sensitive to anything that even smells like a Mega circumventing the rules.  Those that wanted Colonies, wanted it to get away from the Megas.  When they find themselves in the same situation on the Colonies server, they will leave for good.  They will lose any and all faith in the Devs to deliver to them a game that they want to play.

[Willard 245]

2 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

Not to mention the fact that they have already started down this road.  In the beginning, was there even a limit?  I know at some point, it was 500, then went to 250, and now on the Colonies server, it will be 50.  The reasonable situation is for there to be two servers, one with limits and one without.  They did that, but it seems that the Megas wanted the rules implemented on Colonies, except the member and alliance limits, so the obvious fix is to have the limits even more strict on Colonies, but add the Colonies rules that the Megas want, to the Empires server.  This seems obvious...have a meeting with the Megas again, and ask them which of the rules they like, and which they do not like, and make the Empires server to meet their needs.

The present course appears to be a fiasco.  We know the Megas are coming to the Colonies server, so many are not going to play, and those that do, are going to be hyper sensitive to anything that even smells like a Mega circumventing the rules.  Those that wanted Colonies, wanted it to get away from the Megas.  When they find themselves in the same situation on the Colonies server, they will leave for good.  They will lose any and all faith in the Devs to deliver to them a game that they want to play.

Megas won't play against other Megas on different server. In an mmo everyone wants to play where the population is. And the population of Atlas isn't big enough to divide it.

[gnihar 111]

7 minutes ago, Willard said:

Megas won't play against other Megas on different server. In an mmo everyone wants to play where the population is. And the population of Atlas isn't big enough to divide it.

They need to have 2 servers with same mechanic but different ruleset, one with tribe limit and the other without, as Jack said on many ocasions, and to which I agree completely. They only need to host a decent discount on steam and ad towards small groups, and I am positive that the majority of small groups that left the first month would give them a chance again. Let the 6kish people on both eu and na combined  who are zerg afecionados dwell on no limit server and have fun there. Oh wait... their fun is to attack a lot smaller opponents.

Edited April 2, 2019 by gnihar

[Willard 245]

27 minutes ago, gnihar said:

They need to have 2 servers with same mechanic but different ruleset, one with tribe limit and the other without, as Jack said on many ocasions, and to which I agree completely. They only need to host a decent discount on steam and ad towards small groups, and I am positive that the majority of small groups that left the first month would give them a chance again. Let the 6kish people on both eu and na combined  who are zerg afecionados dwell on no limit server and have fun there. Oh wait... their fun is to attack a lot smaller opponents.

I told you noone will play on dead servers. Megas won't play with themselves on a server where only Megas are. 90% of population is outside of Megas which means "Megas server" will be empty. MMO with empty servers = dead MMO.

You guys should start thinking about how to cooperate between each other and strike those Megas instead of trying to force them to play on a different server. They simply won't.

[LinkesAuge 22]

All this talk about "Megas" is anyways stupid. It's not like there is even a clear line or definition where one company becomes "Mega". Like what is a company going to do if it grows and becomes a so called "mega"? Leave everything on the Colony server behind and go to Empires? Same question in regards to the other case. What happens if you lose members/split up and become a smaller company? What are you going to do on the Empire Server? Leave it and start over on Colonies?

And what exactly is preventing "SuperMega" companies? A so called "mega" might face the same problems as smaller/mid sized companies have on the current server in regards to bigger companies/alliances.

There is just no solution to politics in a MMO that is directed by its players. What would be needed is proper incentives for certain actions through game mechanics we currently lack but trying to seperate "small" and "big" companies is a fools errant and will need to nowhere (it's at best a short term fix).

[Jack Shandy 242]

14 minutes ago, LinkesAuge said:

All this talk about "Megas" is anyways stupid. It's not like there is even a clear line or definition where one company becomes "Mega". Like what is a company going to do if it grows and becomes a so called "mega"? Leave everything on the Colony server behind and go to Empires? Same question in regards to the other case. What happens if you lose members/split up and become a smaller company? What are you going to do on the Empire Server? Leave it and start over on Colonies?

There soon will be, it's called company and alliance limits.

As to what to do when you reach that limit, it's up to you! you can stay on smaller company size server and play easy mode or move and play with the big boys. Conversly if the big boy server is too much for you, then certainly move back to the small fry server.

18 minutes ago, LinkesAuge said:

There is just no solution to politics in a MMO that is directed by its players.

No truer a statement,

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

3 hours ago, Willard said:

I told you noone will play on dead servers. Megas won't play with themselves on a server where only Megas are. 90% of population is outside of Megas which means "Megas server" will be empty. MMO with empty servers = dead MMO.

You guys should start thinking about how to cooperate between each other and strike those Megas instead of trying to force them to play on a different server. They simply won't.

 

Or we just go find a new game.

If the Megas don't want to play on dead servers, they should disband.  If they act like Megas on the Colonies server, it won't be long before they are the only ones left.

[Willard 245]

5 minutes ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

 

Or we just go find a new game.

If the Megas don't want to play on dead servers, they should disband.  If they act like Megas on the Colonies server, it won't be long before they are the only ones left.

Man it´s totally new system. Megas were created by merging different companies all together. A lot of those companies will play alone on new system. Playing in a Mega company isn´t exactly fun, it´s just safe. Merging together was needed because of offline raids etc. It won´t be necessary in new system, at least the urge won´t be that strong. 

We don´t know how many of those Megas stay together or even IF they stay together. You are predicting worst possible scenarios. 

Edited April 2, 2019 by Willard

[Captain Jack Shadow 488]

Just now, Willard said:

Man it´s totally new system. Megas were created by merging different companies all together. A lot of those companies will play alone on new system. Playing in a Mega company isn´t exactly fun, it´s just safe. Merging together was needed because of offline raids etc. It won´t be necessary in new system, at least the urge won´t be that strong. 

We don´t know how many of those Megas stay together or even IF they stay together. You are predicting worst possible scenarios. 

I am predicting most likely scenario.  I understand metagamers.  I also heard about the megas telling Grapeshot that they couldn't enforce the limits...that they would still work together.  So I am very much predicting the decline of the game, when those Megas act like a Mega on Colonies.  Take a hint.  We don't want you there.

[Willard 245]

14 minutes ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

I am predicting most likely scenario.  I understand metagamers.  I also heard about the megas telling Grapeshot that they couldn't enforce the limits...that they would still work together.  So I am very much predicting the decline of the game, when those Megas act like a Mega on Colonies.  Take a hint.  We don't want you there.

Ok I´m just done, I see we won´t persuade each other.  You think you know exactly how Megas work, what Megas plan and how things will be. Lets see how many of your predictions will come true  I will gladly admit you were right after it works like you predict. 

Edited April 2, 2019 by Willard

[LinkesAuge 22]

3 hours ago, Jack Shandy said:

There soon will be, it's called company and alliance limits.

As to what to do when you reach that limit, it's up to you! you can stay on smaller company size server and play easy mode or move and play with the big boys. Conversly if the big boy server is too much for you, then certainly move back to the small fry server.

No truer a statement,

 

Do you understand the nature of cooperation?

Or easier question, do you understand that 2 > 1.

As long as that is true there will always be an incentive to gravitate towards bigger groups, no matter the "rules" as long as you want to simulate a "world" in an MMO and not have some kind of static experience.

The game won't suddenly be more enjoyable in the absence of "Megas" because that hole will be filled by other kinds of cooperation where the bigger (stronger) dominate the smaller (weaker). That's why I talked about creating certain incentives through game mechanics but you keep going on about company sizes which are only a result, not the source of the problems.

 

PS: Just as disclaimer, I'm not part of a "mega" (I was in Eve-Online so I understand that side too) but thinking getting rid of them will fix anything is preposterous, especially with much bigger problems around (like the rampant cheating, duping and hacking).

[Percieval 1,067]

12 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

Which is why the Devs should limit the number of people in an Alliance to something like 80, and only allow one Alliance, not two.  Think about how this system they are talking about will work.  I could literally have an 800 man Company, still working together.  So you would divide into groups of 200.  You have 50 fighters in each Alliance, and they would all be in one company.  So then the 50 man fighter companies would also join together in a 200 man fighting alliance.   This group, this Mega will rule just as they ruled before, and people will leave and never come back, no matter what an update promises, because this update, with the Colonies, and Empires was supposed to give the little guy a chance.  When it doesn't, he is gone for good.

Like I said before, any cap on any number of crew/alliance won’t change a single thing to this game. They and we will always work around it quite easily. Best they can do is nerf the animals dead  

[Salty Jack 56]

I have refrained from posting in pvp thread because I don't pvp in this game... I do on the other hand read all the topics of discussion...

I did just have a thought I wanted to share, then I will sit back and let those of you who pvp comment on it if you choose to....

Instead of trying to make company's downsize which It seems cannot be done, could there be a way to reward company for being small ?....

Reward a company based on how much damage they do to another company relative to the size of the 2 company's involved....

Land damage being restricted to the two parties involved in the war token declaration thing.... Company size plus the number of people in the company's you are allied with being combined for you total number.... You would be able to have a many allies as you want.... Your number when it comes to this mechanic would just be higher....

For example, if a 10 man company destroys the base of a 100 man company they would have 1000 gold deposited in their tax bank.... On the other hand if a company of 500 destroys the base of a 10 man group it will cost them 500 gold for the privilege of beating up on a smaller foe....

Ship on ship combat on the open seas would not be effected by this mechanic as I understand all of you want more ship on ship action....

[gnihar 111]

4 hours ago, LinkesAuge said:

 

Do you understand the nature of cooperation?

Or easier question, do you understand that 2 > 1.

As long as that is true there will always be an incentive to gravitate towards bigger groups, no matter the "rules" as long as you want to simulate a "world" in an MMO and not have some kind of static experience.

The game won't suddenly be more enjoyable in the absence of "Megas" because that hole will be filled by other kinds of cooperation where the bigger (stronger) dominate the smaller (weaker). That's why I talked about creating certain incentives through game mechanics but you keep going on about company sizes which are only a result, not the source of the problems.

 

PS: Just as disclaimer, I'm not part of a "mega" (I was in Eve-Online so I understand that side too) but thinking getting rid of them will fix anything is preposterous, especially with much bigger problems around (like the rampant cheating, duping and hacking).

Then I am un-natural as I detest big groups, even if I end up leading one of them. Now, I would much rather uninstall then choose to merge into one.

 

edit: regarding the duping, hacking and exploiting, guess where it starts first? Yep, in zerg tribes.

Edited April 2, 2019 by gnihar

[DilBert 42]

So are the "megas" still going to colonies now that Empires has the same rule set except the company/alliance limits?