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DNAofDeath

Game's dead, nice try Grapeshot, gg wp

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OMG, another person having a go at pushing his own opinions on stats ? 😄 

Let me have a go: 

Optimistic side : Atlas launched during a huge holiday so people had more time to play back then and also it was the hype of a new game thus higher numbers of players. Downfall of said players = veni vidi vici. They played, saw it wasn't what they wanted, left or got bored.

Pessimistic view : Atlas had always had huge numbers of players, but bad management, bad game mechanics, bad something is driving people away, doomsday is upon us I predict it !

Realistic point : Play the game if you like it, help shape it into a great game or if you don't like it, stop spamming forums with crap predictions and go find another pirate game / ship game / building game / whatever you are searching for.

 

Seriously every day there are 2-3 people with "Atlas is dying". Jiz.. give it a break. Understand how people function, some maybe want to wait for the game to get out of EA before playing (but bought it to see what the fuss is about and still have it at a probably reduced price during in EA than after launch), some have tried it and it's not their cup of tea, some have left because of changes, some have joined because of changes, some have strong feeling about A, others have strong feelings about B, you can never please everybody. People come and go. 

 

It feels a bit like every new generation is all about "the game is dying because you are not doing what I want" or "my feelings are hurt because you used the wrong words to talk to me". How long will this last? Will it ever end ? 😄 

Also, another thing, stating your "age" and "occupation" does not make you smarter or wiser, so cut it out and discuss on point, don't throw irrelevant crap to support your opinion.

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Game is not dead, it is not even born. Right now it is an embryo, which will develope over time, with the help of the players, into its intended form. Your numbers may be real, but without meaning. 

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23 minutes ago, JohnM81 said:

Ark didnt decline right after launch. It actually grew. 

Well aware of that. That's the contrast. Ark was by any reasonable measure a hit, and while it's common for games to see a decline after launch as the initial burst of interest fades when some folks move on, with Ark it grew, while with Atlas it plummeted. What did I say in my previous post that gave you the impression I thought or was asserting otherwise?

 

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9 minutes ago, Ben de Witt said:

Game is not dead, it is not even born. Right now it is an embryo, which will develope over time, with the help of the players, into its intended form. Your numbers may be real, but without meaning. 

Stillborn. Rip

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14 minutes ago, Ben de Witt said:

Game is not dead, it is not even born. Right now it is an embryo, which will develope over time, with the help of the players, into its intended form. Your numbers may be real, but without meaning. 

Au contraire mon frere. The phrase "You never get a second chance to make a first impression" goes double in the gaming industry. To say that gamers as a group have a short attention span is ----Oooo look Anthem's out! I bet it's gonna be awesome and not suck at all!

What was I saying?

Right.

Atlas.

Numbers.

Meaning.

Look there is a hard truth to face here. If it weren't for Bethesda inventing new ways to piss off their own fans with Fallout 76, or maybe whatever is going on with the aforementioned Anthem right now, Atlas would arguably be one of the worst major game launches ever. If your game forces Steam to suspend it's normally ironclad refund policy in acknowledgement of just how bad you screwed the proverbial pooch, that is not something that is without meaning or consequence for your game's long term success. Atlas may recover from an inauspcious beginning to rise to respectability, but becoming a hit EVER is likely off the table, and respectable numbers will take a lot of hard work, righting the ship, and will be an uphill fight.

Personally since I prefer to play one or two games for long term periods rather than hopping from game to game, I would like to see that happen, but I'm not gonna piss on anyone's leg and tell them it's raining in the meantime. Don't fool yourself, this game has potential but is off to a very bad start, and that is exactly  what those numbers mean.

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34 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Well aware of that. That's the contrast. Ark was by any reasonable measure a hit, and while it's common for games to see a decline after launch as the initial burst of interest fades when some folks move on, with Ark it grew, while with Atlas it plummeted. What did I say in my previous post that gave you the impression I thought or was asserting otherwise?

 

Ark is an example that there is no such rule that EA games decline right release. What is a game similar to atlas that did? I ask because if the only data we have of similar games NOT declining after release shouldn't we all be running around saying normally they don't instead of that they do???

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32 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Don't fool yourself, this game has potential but is off to a very bad start

That maybe true, but it does not prevent it from becoming a great game. I think a large number of people who bought the game did not take the EA status of the game seriously enough and are now terribly dissappointed. Maybe Grapeshot is to blame for this misconception because of their communication and marketing.

All I know is, this game is in early access, meaning it is not ready developed, and it allready has a lot of the ingrediances, that could make it to a great game, that I look forward to.

Your numbers are meaningless, they refer to a game in EA.

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Just now, JohnM81 said:

Ark is an example that there is no such rule that EA games decline right release. What is a game similar to atlas that did? I ask because if the only data we have of similar games NOT declining after release shouldn't we all be running around saying normally they don't instead of that they do???

Games in general that have a lot of pre launch interest (a la Atlas) tend to see a launch spike that tails off. What counts as data depends largely on your definition of similar games. The more narrowly you define that the fewer examples you have to examine, but the more likely those examples are to correlate. Conversely a more broad definition would give a greater sample size but call into question how well all of the samples correlate. 

I would posit that one of the reasons Ark didn't see a decline was because it was an extremely innovative concept. Survival was an up and coming genre at the time and lots and lots of people love dinosaurs. Frankly, the fact that major dino oriented games prior to Ark consisted of Turok and, well, Turok is a bit of a head scratcher, but I think the fact there wasn't much out there meant Wildcard capitalized on a demand the whole industry had overlooked. One of the crucial differences between Eve's economy and every other online gaming economy out there is the buy order. Buy orders allow the demand side of supply and demand to be expressed. What no one realized until Ark because there is no gaming industry buy order is that there was significant demand for a dino game done right. Ark got it more right than wrong, and the proof of that is the game's success despite some rather glaring technical shortfalls in it's design and execution .

In short, I think there are a number of reasons to believe that Wildcard caught lightening in a bottle with Ark and what we are seeing with Atlas is a failure to do so a second time. To go back to the questions you actually asked (see I got back on my own), I suspect that comparing Atlas only to Ark isn't very useful, as the only thing they really have in common is the development studio. They aren't even the same genre of game really. When you look more broadly across gaming, it is more common for games to see big numbers right at launch and shortly after if the game had a lot of pre launch interest, then for those numbers to tail off to some degree as the crowds that were only interested in having a look at the new shiny thing move on to the next shiny thing.

In that context Ark and Atlas are polar opposites, neither representing the most common game experience.  But you are right, there is no hard and fast rule and never has been, there is only rule of thumb or typical or commonly at best.  Don't look now but No Man's Sky has been busily thumbing it's nose at the entire notion anyone can predict anything about a game's success or failure.

OMG It's gonna be huge!

OMG it's a total fraud. Complete rip off! It's going down in flames and the developers might actually go to jail!

Hey, umm wait, I think he's not quite dead Jim.

Holy shit Jim, he's kinda showing signs of life.

Jim he's flying! The patient is actually @#$%ING FLYING! Look at those numbers holy @#$% that's amazing that it recovered after so loo---

Nope. Looks like he's down again.

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11 minutes ago, Ben de Witt said:

That maybe true, but it does not prevent it from becoming a great game. I think a large number of people who bought the game did not take the EA status of the game seriously enough and are now terribly dissappointed. Maybe Grapeshot is to blame for this misconception because of their communication and marketing.

All I know is, this game is in early access, meaning it is not ready developed, and it allready has a lot of the ingrediances, that could make it to a great game, that I look forward to.

Your numbers are meaningless, they refer to a game in EA.

We are talking about two different things. You are talking about your personal opinion and perception of the game. I am talking about the game's overall reception and reputation in the marketplace. Where you are absolutely right is that if you like it, play it, and who gives a @#$% what anybody else thinks. I also agree that many players have unfair or unrealistic expectations of Early Access games. Folks familiar with my posting history are rolling their eyes right now and muttering "oh great, here he goes about EA standards again." I'm not gonna do that, check my posting history if you want to know what thats all about, suffice to say I think there is some blame on both sides, but given that Wildshot didn't exactly hype the game up a lot, I think most of the blame for expectations lies with players. Grapecard has done it's fair share of things wrong, but not having an endless hype campaign for Atlas, just announcing your game's launch at a big industry event and then launching it shortly thereafter is a move I agree with.

But here's where dismissing the numbers as meaningless misses the point, EA or no. Like it or not, a game's success at launch has a huge impact on it's long term prospects. Small games flying under the radar have a different ruleset to some degree, but big name titles like Atlas get defined by their initial impression in the marketplace, EA or no. The reason this should concern you is that Atlas as a game with a vast multiplayer (theoretically) economy driven world needs lots of players to live up to it's potential. You may see that potential, but if not many others do, the game you play will suffer for it.

Edited by boomervoncannon
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Just now, boomervoncannon said:

We are talking about two different things. You are talking about your personal opinion and perception of the game. I am talking about the game's overall reception and reputation in the marketplace.

No, we are talking about the same thing, and you are wrong, your numbers are meaningless for the verdict about the game, which is in EA, in active developement. 

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10 minutes ago, Ben de Witt said:

No, we are talking about the same thing, and you are wrong, your numbers are meaningless for the verdict about the game, which is in EA, in active developement. 

Did you read the rest of the post or stop there?

If you read what I wrote carefully, you will notice nowhere have I used the word verdict. Nowhere have I declared Atlas to be dead, only that it's off to a bad start and that is a hard thing to recover from. You can declare that meaningless til you are blue in the face, but that does not make it so. As evidence of a bad start Steam's numbers (not mine) are therefore not meaningless.  To much of the short attention span crowd that quit Atlas and left bad reviews, it likely matters very little that the game is in EA. It is very likely that they aren't coming back and they will bad mouth the game to others when it comes up. This is the reality of the marketplace. Overcoming that isn't impossible but it is difficult, regardless of development in progress.

Edited by boomervoncannon

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If it’s dead to melodramatic doomsayers then can they please let me know (on the authority they so finely exhibit) what the hell I should play now instead? I’m a total sheep when it comes to games. I like this game but now I guess I need to be told what to play instead. 

Like, I’m inclined to stay and play atlas because I like it ( even with the wipe and upcoming patches to pvp) but I keep seeing these threads essentially telling me that I shouldn’t like it cos’ muh metrics. 

any advice on what I should eat for breakfast and wear to work will help too. 

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6 minutes ago, Polar Express said:

If it’s dead to melodramatic doomsayers then can they please let me know (on the authority they so finely exhibit) what the hell I should play now instead? I’m a total sheep when it comes to games. I like this game but now I guess I need to be told what to play instead. 

Like, I’m inclined to stay and play atlas because I like it ( even with the wipe and upcoming patches to pvp) but I keep seeing these threads essentially telling me that I shouldn’t like it cos’ muh metrics. 

any advice on what I should eat for breakfast and wear to work will help too. 

Special K with bananas and brightly colored clothing so that the doomsayers don't run you over as they drive about playing with their phones in traffic.

Btw if Atlas survives and gets things turned around, it will be in part because people like you actually think for themselves instead of just listening to what everyone else says.

 

Edited by boomervoncannon
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Lol thanks bro. Hahahaha. You have some good points in this thread and it’s pretty good to see a thread with people actually discussing the topic maturely. I’ve just come over from the last captains log thread and it’s autistic screeching and pure cancer over there.

 

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4 minutes ago, Polar Express said:

If it’s dead to melodramatic doomsayers then can they please let me know (on the authority they so finely exhibit) what the hell I should play now instead? I’m a total sheep when it comes to games. I like this game but now I guess I need to be told what to play instead. 

Like, I’m inclined to stay and play atlas because I like it ( even with the wipe and upcoming patches to pvp) but I keep seeing these threads essentially telling me that I shouldn’t like it cos’ muh metrics. 

any advice on what I should eat for breakfast and wear to work will help too. 

People Like you are the worst. Unable to Accept other people Opinions and wondering why nobody ist taking you serious.

If you dont Like Threads Like this one ignore it. You are helping nobody, Just trolling.

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1 minute ago, Luck0r said:

People Like you are the worst. Unable to Accept other people Opinions and wondering why nobody ist taking you serious.

If you dont Like Threads Like this one ignore it. You are helping nobody, Just trolling.

Ooft! That stung man. Anymore sage advice there senpai?

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3 minutes ago, Luck0r said:

People Like you are the worst. Unable to Accept other people Opinions and wondering why nobody ist taking you serious.

If you dont Like Threads Like this one ignore it. You are helping nobody, Just trolling.

I have no idea how you got what you just said from Polar's posts. That's not what I got at all. But it is ironic that you tell him to ignore things he doesn't like, but then don't follow your own advice in posting to criticize him.  If he should ignore posts he doesn't like, shouldn't you? 

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Thanks my dude. I’ve read a lot of your posts in the past. There are very few people in these threads that don’t just deal in absolutes and try to bring an objective view. So far a lot of your stuff is really constructive from what I’ve seen. 

Keep up the good work. 👍

13 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Special K with bananas and brightly colored clothing so that the doomsayers don't run you over as they drive about playing with their phones in traffic.

Btw if Atlas survives and gets things turned around, it will be in part because people like you actually think for themselves instead of just listening to what everyone else says.

 

Most people just need to chill out and realise playing this game shouldn’t feel like a job. If this game is hurting people then that is what concerns me.

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53 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Overcoming that isn't impossible but it is difficult, regardless of development in progress.

I think we can settle our argument with your statement.

There is no guarantee, that the game will succeed, and that is not the prospect I hold. But I hope and wish, that it will succeed after 24 month of developing in an open early access process.

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The game plays better with 1-3k people.

Am I alone on this? 

Maybe one day, when lots more stuff is added, it would be better to see 5k-10k on the map. But not now. The way it plays/played is terrible. Im a big fan of the game, or at least the concept,  and I cant wait for the update.

Ive been having fun with the spawn anywhere rule. Even with only around 1500 players on, every inch of every island ive been to so far is just wall to wall claimed by a top 10 company. There can be no one in sever, pop down a claim and they magically show up. With bed travel the map could never be big enough.

Everything done on land is before, durring and after attack of the snakes. My next toon will be named Sam Jackson.

Some of the clever EA players relentlessly,  shamelessly cheated no holds barred.

All of this is the play experience of most people who tried to play after buying the game in EA. Its no question round 1 was a loss for Atlas.

This is 2019 though. The gaming industry is fucked. Anygame thats not riddled with P2W and/or loot boxes is going to look appealing. Atlas isnt dead and cant be becuase it hasnt released yet. If it doesnt release, then it was never going to and thats a different conversation. 

Lets dig a little deeper...

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Ever been wandering around a mega companies island and thought to yourself, wow that rock and tree look familiar. Or what about those stone builings? Look alot like pubg? Or various other games made with UR4?

UR4 engine is amazeballs. Have any of you looked into it? Its so good in fact that you dont even have to be an experienced professional to start putting a game together. With enough motivation and free time to youtube you can start building something in hours. Just use the prebuilt assest. That look so familiar...

This has one wondering, since I didnt play Ark.  Are there actuall trained developers building this? Or ...is this a B team of wannabes who would never get hired on at a bigger company due to lack of former training? Im talking about it being 2019 and we cant get 200 people on a server with no lag? Im talking we cant put in the work to make sure structures mesh together correctly? Im alking about how hard firm bans on cheaters and giving asia their own servers is mmo 101!

Again, so far im still a fan. But i wonder as some things are less than professional looking. I guess I compare them the Intrepid Studios team and the Rare team on my head. The ideas sound like they are there, but the communication, game plan and execution is not on par with thier peers yet. The major changes and scheduled ptr, wipe and patch are all moves in the right direction though.

 

-CS

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2 hours ago, boomervoncannon said:

I have no idea how you got what you just said from Polar's posts. That's not what I got at all. But it is ironic that you tell him to ignore things he doesn't like, but then don't follow your own advice in posting to criticize him.  If he should ignore posts he doesn't like, shouldn't you? 

This topic is about critism, everyone who can not deal with that is wrong here. Period. 

His Post was clearly sarcastic, no need to make fun of other Peoples opinions. Thats what People do who do not accept other opinions.

 

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1 hour ago, Luck0r said:

This topic is about critism, everyone who can not deal with that is wrong here. Period. 

His Post was clearly sarcastic, no need to make fun of other Peoples opinions. Thats what People do who do not accept other opinions.

 

I will let the irony of your post speak for itself.

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I don't know a single person since I started playing, that told me that they were leaving permanently because they didn't like the game. I am one of the people that hasn't logged on since they announced the wipe. It is the same for a lot of people. I frankly think it is the great game. If you think so, then don't be so worried. If you don't then quit playing and stop crying on these forums about predictions, acting like Ark is the better title. I have heard from almost every single former ARK player that ATLAS is the better title. You must have anxiety or something bro cuz you're way too worried bout a video game in alpha.

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