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Nik Storm

New PVE claim

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maybe i miss understood something no claim flags. So you will have Ark building in Atlas. Which is fine expect that so many building wil lhappen no resources will respawn. How are they going to address that issue?

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I think they are counting on the upkeep cost stopping foundation spamming that cause this problem but I'm worried about this too. I'm also worried about people walling in people house or walling people off the island all typically ways of griefing others. The problem is if they make the upkeep high enough to prevent spamming for big guilds then it will cripple the small players from building decent size bases, that why I don't think this system will work. 

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The claim system is the only thing preventing normal PvE greifing in this game.  See your neighbor building a galleon for weeks?  Build a wall of pillars so they cant sail it out.  Cost of upkeep? cant be much compared to the cost of a Galleon.  Seriously, w/o the claim system I see this being much worse than Ark PvE because at least in Ark you could fly out.  People are already greifing with pillar spam and simple things like parking boats to block shipyards.  The claim system is the only thing ensuring that this is not an issue for most players.

IMO, if they do this change it will break all the fun building parts, replacing it with the shitty old foundation/pillar spam and greifing which drove me away from Ark official PvE.

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Just let them launch the update, after 2 days people will ask for a wipe due to foundations spam and gigantic gates blocking ways.

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2 hours ago, Skinner NA PVE said:

I don’t know if I will play at all but I also feel obligated to show they how this isn’t better by being one of those Bholes.

Yeah, I usually am not a complainer, but I had hoped this game would be my next 2k hour game.  I just cant imagine myself doing another solo build up if I cannot even reliably build a nice area w/o greifing.  If it is that again I might also be one of those "Bholes" who says they might not play after this update 🙂

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The Flag claim system was why I was willing to play Atlas instead of what they are going to try now. I have been in 2 small companies and we have been able to claim land and enjoy the game. This is beginning to sound like everything is going to make a 180 and return to the system that was in Ark which isnt on my favorite list. Up the rate your building deteriates? How is a solo player or small company going to be able to do anything besides gather resources to keep what they have? I will enjoy whats left of my time with the claims I can afford to build and create on or redesign if I dont like what my home or structure looks like while its possible. Need those 3 or 4 different types of that one certain resource for a blueprint? I guess a freeport is our only hope because we cant afford to explore to find them. I have enjoyed this game and have been able to build things at my own pace as long as I kept loggin in every so often to upkeep my claim. Just limiting claims per character would go a long way to opening up land, maybe make claims on the shore or near a lake count as 2 or 3 claims based off of thier desirability that may help. But to turn to a system that has already proven that a select group of players will be able to enjoy it and basically drive others out. Is that the product you want to promote even in Early access that alone will drive players/customers/testers away. Anyhow I will enjoy Atlas for a least another month until the foundation brigade starts invading your space you thought you could claim as your own.

Edited by Spry_one DeRonin
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I've never seen a company as tone deaf as Grapeshot. You literally have hundreds of suggestions on the forums and reddit - some good, some bad, some feasible, some impossible...and this is what you give us?

You guys manage to do literally the exact opposite of what the majority of your player base wants, damn near every time.

People LIKED the claim system due to it stopping the griefing that was so prevalent in Ark. What they didn't like was that a couple companies could take over the whole map and not leave any room for anyone. Instead of limiting PVE claims to a reasonable number,  like you are in PVP, even 10-20 per company, you get rid of the PVE claim system entirely, and leave everyone open to foundation/pillar spam griefing, resource blocking, ship blocking, etc - with the added kick in the teeth that its not Ark - if there are douchebags who pillar/foundation the most desirable areas to stop anyone from having them, you can't just find another server with a lower assclown ration.

You're even adding over 200 new islands for people to pillar and spam to unusableness. You have a pissed off playerbase, with a lot of time on their hands. Do you really think that a portion of them aren't going to make life as miserable as possible for anyone who attempts to keep playing?  If you would re-think this to something like limit claims to 10 per company, 20 per company with at least 25 members, and 50 per company with 50+ members, as well as opening the 200 new islands, and even open lawless to be claimable, that would open more than enough land for anyone currently playing, and anyone who wants to play in the future.

People didn't want to be tenants because they had 0 protections against landlords pulling their build rights, which killed that dead in the water. Instead of fixing it so that people had a reason to be tenants, with basic protections, it turned into 'Nope, burn it all down..."

People wanted to be able to trade easily and efficiently, for all kinds of goods, taking all kinds of payments. They wanted reasons to go visit other people's lands, they wanted to give people a reason to visit their land, and reasons to go to far off lands, acquire goods, and easily re-sell them to their neighbors for profit. Nope, you get vendors in freeport, for gold only.

People didn't want the wipe, due to discovery points, etc. Bases, resources, blueprints, etc...yeah, they suck to get and rebuild. Instead of just a land and item wipe, Nope, clean slate. - this isn't as bad as the others, but, still going to cost more players than just the land/item wipe would have.

This has been a consistent theme, all the way back to the ship weight griefing. People wanted their ships to be safe when they logged off, and suggested that if the ship was at anchor, it wouldn't take overweight damage. Nope, we get magic fly traps.

Yeah, I know, these are all PVE concerns, because thats mainly where I play, but I know that the PVP side is just as pissed about having to pencil wars in their date book, among other things.

 

The people who compared the games trajectory to No Mans Sky, or Rust, saying that "Oh, Grapeshot said they're listening to the players now. They're going to turn it around.", aren't doing that so much any more. I'm kinda scared to see what the Steam review are going to look like going forward.  When we asked you to listen to the players, we didn't mean to listen to what we were saying, and decide to implement the opposite, or the most half-ass way of what we were asking for.

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I made a suggestion on the forums. Let's show the developers in one voice that this is a bad idea.

 

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2 minutes ago, Mythathos said:

I made a suggestion on the forums. Let's show the developers in one voice that this is a bad idea.

 

i supported you, need to all PvE player EU and US to support this one 

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We were told the claim system was going to be revamped.

Well, simply removing it entirely from PvE is not a revamp. It's just choosing the easy option of getting rid of a problem. Which in itself will create further problems.

I for one liked having my own little claim, it is what interested me in Atlas. Removing that removes my interest.

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4 minutes ago, [GP] Guybrush Threepwood said:

We were told the claim system was going to be revamped.

Well, simply removing it entirely from PvE is not a revamp. It's just choosing the easy option of getting rid of a problem. Which in itself will create further problems.

I for one liked having my own little claim, it is what interested me in Atlas. Removing that removes my interest.

I'm struggling to get a majority of my company to even play after the wipe, which won't happen without those claim flags.

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Wait a moment these changes will not occur in the PVE correct ? because after almost 900 hours playing visiting numerous islands and being exploded of almost all, to be invited to be a "SLAVE" in the lands of the big companies, to spend a good part of time suffering in lawless islands and now that I finally have a piece of land just mine I'm going to have to go back to live like before with griefer can block my shipyeard or build large gates at the door of my house or sink my ships ???!!!

 

I'll tell you what's going to happen good players will leave this game and only griefers and cheaters will remain on the best islands and when after several complaints from the players the old system will return to the islands will be theirs and they will win

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Rising said:

Wait a moment these changes will not occur in the PVE correct ? because after almost 900 hours playing visiting numerous islands and being exploded of almost all, to be invited to be a "SLAVE" in the lands of the big companies, to spend a good part of time suffering in lawless islands and now that I finally have a piece of land just mine I'm going to have to go back to live like before with griefer can block my shipyeard or build large gates at the door of my house or sink my ships ???!!!

 

I'll tell you what's going to happen good players will leave this game and only griefers and cheaters will remain on the best islands and when after several complaints from the players the old system will return to the islands will be theirs and they will win

 

 

Nope, PVP gets whole island claim flags. PVE gets whole world lawless griefing. Now with 200+ more islands to be foundation spammed.

Enjoy.

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6 hours ago, TheSeer said:

I think they are counting on the upkeep cost stopping foundation spamming that cause this problem but I'm worried about this too. I'm also worried about people walling in people house or walling people off the island all typically ways of griefing others. The problem is if they make the upkeep high enough to prevent spamming for big guilds then it will cripple the small players from building decent size bases, that why I don't think this system will work. 

Upkeep wont stop Players from Pillar spamming. How should the system differ between a normal player and an idiot? The decay will indeed need its time, because otherwise the house collapses, just because you are two weeks on vacation. So I have to wait and hope that within the time or shortly thereafter, the next idiot is not at the door.

Do I have to spam pillars myself to reserve the necessary expansion area?

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Again people dont understand it not foudation spams. You  could have so many people on one island with their small forts or houses causing no resources. Devs in this game are not very smart

Edited by Nik Storm

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The issue is that either the upkeep either has to be so expensive to stop people from pillar/foundation spamining, that it will in turn make it so expensive to  maintain your own structures, that you can't build intricate bases, else your upkeep will necessitate that an inordinate amount of farming, just to maintain a decent sized base.

A 10x10 building, 2 stories tall, is 100 foundations, 100 ceilings, and 80 walls. 280 pieces.  How many resources can be blocked, and how much griefing can be done with 280 foundations placed around an island?

Even with decay, whats to stop someone from dropping a foundation on a metal spawn, or at the very edge of your base build zone, never putting upkeep in it, and just replacing it every few days or so as it decays? You get to pay upkeep., They are out the cost of a foundation.

 

I realize that their is an issue with people overclaiming land now. Limiting claims would be a helluva lot better solution than this. if every company with <25 people got 10 claims, 25-100 people got 25 claims, and companies with 100+ got 50 claims, it would free up a ridiculous amount of land.

To bring the maths into the discussion, there is now a company with over 3000 land claims. If they could only claim 50, that would leave 2950 more claims free. That would free up the maximum number of landclaims for 59 companies of 100+ people, or 118 companies of 25-100 people, or 295 companies of <25 people. With a max company size of 250, that would mean that up to 14,750 people would have land claims.

...and thats just the amount of land 1 top 10 company has.  There are others with 2000+ land claims, there are multiple others with 1000+ land claims. All the way down to the 1 and 2 person companies that have 40-100 claims.

When you couple that with 200+ claimable islands being added, there would be more than ample room for everyone playing the game today, and damn sure enough room for everyone who will continue playing after wipe. Hell, there would be enough land for everyone who has ever played on the PVE servers, with plenty of room to spare for new players.

 

PVE players are generally low-key and chill people who just want to build and explore, socialize, tame, and trade, without being griefed. This patch takes away a good portion of that. Building will have to cost too much to maintain, and the griefers will kill the resources needed to do it. You won't have time to explore, because you'll be too busy farming to maintain the buildings you do have. Traders in freeports, only trading for gold, is a rant for another time. Socialization is out, due to the massively declined playerbase. So, we can tame and breed. Whee?

 

Grapeshot, we're begging you. Don't go down this road. You have something that other developers would kill for - a devoted, passionate playerbase. A playerbase who has put in hundreds, to over 1000 hours, individually, into the game because they like the core of it. Yes, we asked for changes to make it easier for people to get land, but instead of minor changes, we're getting scorched earth and a griefers paradise.

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Maybe not even need this "wipe" now it's possible new players or who lives in lawless to own a piece of land, sailing around I have already found many territories abandoned by all types of company only the announcement of the wipe of the captain log 22 already caused in the abandonment of the game by many people. Territories where it was impossible to see the flags chronometer with less than 20 days now are 3~5 days or even available.

The best thing about this wipe will be the cleaning of the abandoned boats but without a system for the own owners of the territories or a decay system will take few weeks for all the garbage to be in the servers again.

Well I still play but without that before I might come back after the wipe more only if the flag system and keep the character with my skills, level and discovery points. But I think we're going to lose everything anyway.

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