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Cpt.Yarrr

Please re-think the flag system on PvE.

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Posted (edited)

One flag per island is designed for PVP conquest, it is not suitable for PVE.    How do you decide who gets to be mayor of the island?   The megacorps (now deconstructed into discord allies) that got there first when the release they patch while you was asleep and then once you could get on you spent hours treading water because they will not add spawn docks when they make every grid spawnable?   Have people forgotten how we got into this mess in the first place?

How do you kick a bad mayor and tear down their flag?   How do you deal with the absent landlord bed spawning to move mats from the tax bank into repair bank, that does not actually live there?  How do you keep people out of your garden?

That is why they did not adopt the one flag per island for PVE - how do you make it work without PVP conquest?

The only way to make flagging work is PVE flagging different from PVP flagging.   There are many good suggestions on how PVE flagging was a good idea with a bad implementation, but that required Jat to start having a discourse on these forums about this or that and pros and cons.

 

Edited by krazmuze
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43 minutes ago, krazmuze said:

One flag per island is designed for PVP conquest, it is not suitable for PVE.    How do you decide who gets to be mayor of the island?   The megacorps (now deconstructed into discord allies) that got there first when the release they patch while you was asleep and then once you could get on you spent hours treading water because they will not add spawn docks when they make every grid spawnable?   Have people forgotten how we got into this mess in the first place?

How do you kick a bad mayor and tear down their flag?   How do you deal with the absent landlord bed spawning to move mats from the tax bank into repair bank, that does not actually live there?  How do you keep people out of your garden?

That is why they did not adopt the one flag per island for PVE - how do you make it work without PVP conquest?

The only way to make flagging work is PVE flagging different from PVP flagging.   There are many good suggestions on how PVE flagging was a good idea with a bad implementation, but that required Jat to start having a discourse on these forums about this or that and pros and cons.

 

I dont often quote a full post but this one is well and truly on the money.

Excellent post.

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1 hour ago, krazmuze said:

One flag per island is designed for PVP conquest, it is not suitable for PVE.    How do you decide who gets to be mayor of the island?   The megacorps (now deconstructed into discord allies) that got there first when the release they patch while you was asleep and then once you could get on you spent hours treading water because they will not add spawn docks when they make every grid spawnable?   Have people forgotten how we got into this mess in the first place?

How do you kick a bad mayor and tear down their flag?   How do you deal with the absent landlord bed spawning to move mats from the tax bank into repair bank, that does not actually live there?  How do you keep people out of your garden?

That is why they did not adopt the one flag per island for PVE - how do you make it work without PVP conquest?

The only way to make flagging work is PVE flagging different from PVP flagging.   There are many good suggestions on how PVE flagging was a good idea with a bad implementation, but that required Jat to start having a discourse on these forums about this or that and pros and cons.

 

I agree, don't let's give them the idea just to push that whole thing to pve.

On the other hand some parts of that would work well on pve.  Some system of higher organization than companies to build a town and run an island would work well on pve too.  It just can't be based on land conquest.

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On 3/3/2019 at 3:02 PM, krazmuze said:

One flag per island is designed for PVP conquest, it is not suitable for PVE.    How do you decide who gets to be mayor of the island? 

Whoever plants the flag.

 

On 3/3/2019 at 3:02 PM, krazmuze said:

How do you kick a bad mayor and tear down their flag?   How do you deal with the absent landlord bed spawning to move mats from the tax bank into repair bank, that does not actually live there?

Same way you do now.  You contest it.

There is no repair bank using the system described for PvP.

 

Using a modified version of the PvP system is far from perfect.  But it is better than the disaster of a plan that the devs proposed.  It has the added benefit that it is already developed, the devs have to put in little to no work or thought into it.

I really prefer many of the systems that players have proposed, but players have been proposing these systems all along, and were totally ignored.  So, I say use what the devs have developed, since they seem to like it and would be more willing to listen to themselves.

 

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Posted (edited)

Contesting only works in PVP as it is one flag per island, go kill every last player on the island you win.  In PVE how will you kick the players off the island contesting your contesting?  It would only work if the players long ago quit and nobdy is left on the island (and all their NPC have mutiny), in which case flag decay is a more elegant solution.

There is a repair mechanism, call it a bank or machine, the point is it is centralized so there is no going to every object and repairing it.  

 

Edited by krazmuze
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6 minutes ago, war machine said:

They put a cost for piller spam if u read all the updates

So we will all pay upkeep costs for everything we build?  And what about the people that are willing to pay the upkeep in order to keep your harbor/ships walled in for days at a time?  You okay with that too?

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WALLING IN, IS GRIEVING  AND A BANNABLE OFFENSE

so would i mind someone walling in my ship for a day or 2 to see them banned so i can go loot there shit..

 

hell yea

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6 minutes ago, war machine said:

WALLING IN, IS GRIEVING  AND A BANNABLE OFFENSE

so would i mind someone walling in my ship for a day or 2 to see them banned so i can go loot there shit..

 

hell yea

To each his own then.  If that's the situation we're possibly looking at, I won't waste my time with the game.  At that point, it won't even be worth playing.  

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Posted (edited)

The devs have said they are autoclosing tickets as they are in favor of making exploits and griefing not possible in the game mechanics and they only use tickets to identify the trends.   So relying on admins to fix your problems, will only work on unofficials that actively ban those who do not follow the rules.

The repair cost for a base will always be higher than the repair cost for a pillar.     It only takes one pillar to ruin your ship, block your expansion, etc - and even if they cover the island in a grid of them - your base likely is a bigger structure and will have a higher repair cost.

And even if that tilts the other way and the repair cost of the trolling structures is somehow higher?  That is the price the trolls will pay as they milk your rage for your salty tears.

 

Edited by krazmuze
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I ve worked out Solutions for our problems which we have in pve, because the concept the devs worked feels not playable and unfair.

 

Solutions:

-Keep claimflags in pve limit them to  5-20(depends on amount of company member) per grid and 20 in total per company. Enemy structures. ships, animals or npcs, dont block claiming of an area. All enemy structures and animals on your claim are able to beeing demolished or taken over after 1 hour. Enemy claims cant beeing placed in a short distance to your claim, except you are in an alliance, than your claims can be next to each other.

-keep building everywhere with auto decay and demolish after  5hours, if not on your claim(dont forget we will have to build everywhere to kill animals and monsters)

-removing of water claims

-make ships not gettin damaged on water if they are in a distance to an island.

-unlimited amount of alliances in PVE

-give ships the ability to drive through other ships in pve. 

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A big thanks to Grapeshot for listening to the community and trying to do something for us!

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A big 4Head to Grapeshot for listening to the landlubber which want to have an illusion of owning / dominating something, sitting on "their" land/claims and rebuild Manhattan from "earned" taxes.

I am really interessted in the ratio between caring Landloard and the lazy ones (tax earners). How many will keep different playstyles in mind?

----- In PVE -----

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I was going to write something similar then I found this post. For transparency im in a small company of 3 and we play on PVE – mostly because we’re arnt able to play 24/7, but I understand that some of my concerns and ideas wont pertain to PVP or larger companies. Simply put, we would love to claim a slice of an island and share/trade with others without worrying about griefers. We don’t want to rent and we don’t want a landlord.

Even though we played from release we were alittle slow off the mark to go grab a claim (we play when we can) and we settled on Lawless. We’re ok there but we would have preferred to have a little slice of an island to call ‘home’ lol.  I really don’t like the idea of 1 flag per island or renting in this upcoming patch. We’ll probably settle on Lawless again if we can’t claim a small island. Even without our own claim I didn’t dislike the claim system just the fact that there wasn’t a limit or enough land. I was happy to read that more islands and a limit are being added but I really think having multiple flag claims on one island wasnt a bad thing (and being able to restrict others building on it). I believe limiting flags either per person, per company or even per biome could fix a lot of the issues on PVE. Im not opposed to upkeep costs on flags either, it’ll just be like having to feed your tames or pay your crew. I understand that finding a balance can be difficult to please all but and claiming should be proportionate to the size of your company.

On our little slice of lawless we had some great neighbours and we traded alot but it felt like there were more people on the lawless islands than the claimable ones.  Also another problem that did start to emerge, and ive seen this on many islands on my travels was pillaring and blocking around peoples bases and shipyards. Even with an upkeep system I don’t think it’ll fully solve the problem.

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