Jump to content

Talono

Pets imbalanced ?

Recommended Posts

I tamed all the lower mounts this weekend, here what i found out.

- pig : hits for 10, quite slow, even when running. If you run its out of sramina after a few meters

- horse : hits for 10, good HP and weight, obviously no combat mount, nice speed and jumping. Can keep running for a long time

- ostricht : hits for 19, low HP and weight. Faster than the horse, higher jump also, very agile. Perfect scout mount and not thst bad as combat mount

- wolf : hits for 22, not very fast and runs out of stamina very fast. Can jump a little. Super low weight and HP. Not recommandable.

- bull : hits for 22, good speed, close to horse and can keep the speed for a while without stamina problems, low HP, good weight. A good overall mount. Can jump, but not high.

- bear : absolute overpowered pet. Hits for 35, triple hp of all others, OP weight. Cant jump. Speed in run mode is good, and the bear can keep it for a while without stamina problems

 

Dependent on availability on your island, bear is the first choice without question. Second is the ostrich, as scout perfect. If you have no Ostrich take the bull.

Horse is ok if you dont want to fight with it, for pure scouting of pulling a cart with a cannon.

But to be honest the only pet you ever need is a bear, a bear and another... bear.

Edited by Talono
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Overall, IMO the bear is the go to. I would hate to see it further nerfed. (W/o making the ground game worth a shit)

 

That said, only reason we have two wolves is because they got annoying, so we beat the snot out of em and stuffed full of food until they loved us. (Yes thats taming summed up)

 

Horse and ostrich i think are neat and very much scouts.

I would love to see an equivilent to a bear (weight, hp, damage) so we can pack more than just bears. (And a tiger..  cause its blue 🙄)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't believe I'm actually saying something like this 2x in one day but from a realism standpoint, bears should be one of the more powerful animals, so I can't really fault them for that. I don't think they should be more powerful than elephants and rhinos which are both more powerful animals IRL and higher tier animals in the game. Bears seem to be one of the few animals they did any kind of research on.

Also, the horses' back kick did about 35ish damage before the patch, I haven't tested it since, and will also KO animals with lower torpor thresholds. 

While I agree bears have a lot of utility, I disagree that it's the only animal you need. Elephants can carry more than 2x as much and can harvest wood and thatch from trees, and for some reason, honey from beehives, and rhinos can harvest stone and flint from normal rocks and metal from metal nodes. And once you figure out how to use them, rhinos can defeat some aggro predators without ever being hit themselves, provided you see them coming soon enough you can face them. 

I wouldn't mind the other animals getting buffs, but if bears were any weaker I'd be straight up screwed, so I will disagree with any calls to nerf them. You apparently don't live on an island that is constantly swarmed with hostile aggro predators. Before my company got bears, every day was a bad day. And even still we lose bears on a nearly daily basis. 

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Warspectre said:

I can't believe I'm actually saying something like this 2x in one day but from a realism standpoint, bears should be one of the more powerful animals, so I can't really fault them for that. I don't think they should be more powerful than elephants and rhinos which are both more powerful animals IRL and higher tier animals in the game. Bears seem to be one of the few animals they did any kind of research on.

Also, the horses' back kick did about 35ish damage before the patch, I haven't tested it since, and will also KO animals with lower torpor thresholds. 

While I agree bears have a lot of utility, I disagree that it's the only animal you need. Elephants can carry more than 2x as much and can harvest wood and thatch from trees, and for some reason, honey from beehives, and rhinos can harvest stone and flint from normal rocks and metal from metal nodes. And once you figure out how to use them, rhinos can defeat some aggro predators without ever being hit themselves, provided you see them coming soon enough you can face them. 

I wouldn't mind the other animals getting buffs, but if bears were any weaker I'd be straight up screwed, so I will disagree with any calls to nerf them. You apparently don't live on an island that is constantly swarmed with hostile aggro predators. Before my company got bears, every day was a bad day. And even still we lose bears on a nearly daily basis. 

Stephen Colbert warned us years ago, bears are godless killing machines who will come for your children while you sleep.

Having said that, the Billy Collins poem Flames is by a wide margin, the greatest poem ever written about a bear. That's just a fact.

Flames

Smokey the Bear heads
into the autumn woods
with a red can of gasoline
and a box of wooden matches.

His ranger's hat is cocked
at a disturbing angle.

His brown fur gleams
under the high sun
as his paws, the size
of catcher's mitts,
crackle into the distance.

He is sick of dispensing
warnings to the careless,
the half-wit camper,
the dumbbell hiker.

He is going to show them
how a professional does it. 

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All tames, especially bears are OP for PVP.  It takes a good 10 minutes to kill a passive bear by hand. Even longer with guns. Horse and bear carts are fun, and I want them in the game. I just wish the only counter to a tame wasn't another tame.

However, I don't want their health nerfed to where they'll be easily killed by wild creatures like they used to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Move bear to tier 3 , problem solved . 

Creatures in tier 3 balance each other out , tiger outright beat bear because of its bleeding attack , tighter turn and more damage output  .

And who kill bear by hand ? where your gun ? Shoot them in the head , no way it is 10 mins .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't get why people think bears so OP.

Let's go over the list of tameable animals:
Chicken: Eggs, do not use for combat
Monkey: Heal buff, use for combat only on shoulder
Parrot: Insulation, do not use for combat
Rabbit: Murder for meat
Crow: Int buff, do not use for combat.

Seagull: Swim/breath buff, do not use for combat.
Penguin: Insulation, do not use for combat.
Vulture: Probably good for PvP but I never use them.
Sheep: Fleece/climb cliffs, do not use for combat.

Pig: Poops, do not use for combat.
Cow: Cheap transport, cheap tame, good early.
Bull: Same as above more HP usually, can get 2k+ weight and 400-500hp.

Ostrich/Wolf: Climate controlled mounts, ostrich is great for maps, wolf farm bones, not great combat mounts. Easy tames, good for shooting from.
Horse: High weight transport with good HP. Not great for combat, harder to tame then above for shooting cavalry.
Bear: All rounder T2 pet with no special capability that isn't beaten by a T3. Good tame for it's worth.
Elephant: Wood farmer, good damage, good knockback.
Giraffe: Thatch farmer, great stamina, good for water combat.
Rhino: Fantastic combat damage, good tank, farms all stones.

Lion/tiger: Fantastic damage, farms meat well, limber, hard to tame.

I do not understand why people bitch about bears so fucking much. Pigs are about the only useless tame in the game, and they're fertilizer (they should hold their poop so that farming poop is easy and then pigs are fixed).

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, just to add : i live on several islands. Horse backkick is 14 damage and difficult to aim, so very lol.

Does anyone have the damage for rhino, lion, tiger, elephant and giraffe ?

From what i have seen giraffe is low damage, elephant and rhino are clumbsy, lion and tiger have bad damage and HP.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lion and tiger have bad damage ? Are you drunk ?

Giraffe /Ele hit bad enough and have large AOE . they actually can hit everything from side .

For pure damage alone , a Razortooth with its roar ability will 2 shots most wild elephant and can even go toe to toe with alpha ele / croc .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When there is x2 and x3 tame in a game I see the whole stream of pilgrims sailing to my Tundra island for a bears. One guy set up a two traps there so everyone use it for like 10 times a day. I seriously thinking of build a guest pier there so every1 would be able to go ashore without touching waters (they are cold in Tundra and not every1 well prepared).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Talono said:

Well, just to add : i live on several islands. Horse backkick is 14 damage and difficult to aim, so very lol.

Does anyone have the damage for rhino, lion, tiger, elephant and giraffe ?

From what i have seen giraffe is low damage, elephant and rhino are clumbsy, lion and tiger have bad damage and HP.

Elephant dmg is about the same as bear, big AoE and big knock back. Makes them great for higher end areas that bears get mercilessly killed in.

Rhino dmg isn't fantastic IF you stand still. 37~, about 70 with nature's cry (which does murder everything pretty fast). However, charge attack can deal 500-600 damage with nature's cry, fucker can nearly one shot alphas. Rhino also seems to have an innate 33% damage reduction making him even tankier.

Giraffe is basically slighty more dmg elephant with far less HP and regen. Great for murdering sharks due to the high stamina.

I haven't tamed tigers or lions. My mates that have some say that overkill everything, far more then bears.

Only useless tame is pigs, and if pigs held onto their shits, they'd be fixed as the fertilizer pet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/18/2019 at 2:11 PM, Warspectre said:

I can't believe I'm actually saying something like this 2x in one day but from a realism standpoint...

I'm going to stop you right there. In a game about pirates with dragons and magic there is no need to take the realism standpoint. Balance should take priority!

Edited by Nari

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/18/2019 at 1:40 PM, Talono said:

Dependent on availability on your island, bear is the first choice without question. Second is the ostrich, as scout perfect. If you have no Ostrich take the bull.

Horse is ok if you dont want to fight with it, for pure scouting of pulling a cart with a cannon.

But to be honest the only pet you ever need is a bear, a bear and another... bear.

Are you using the right click attack of the horse or the left click?

My second choice after a bear is the horse. It is faster, jumps (and pretty high), carries about the same weight as the bear, and has a good RMB attack. It does seemed to sometimes run from a fight even when you have it set to attack, so not quite as good for defending you. If I'm out picking up treasure maps, it is my first choice. Also traveling a distance to gather resources, I'll pick it. I think the horse might be faster in the water, not sure.

Not sure I could play the game without the bear, so I hope they don't change it even though it is better than almost ever other tame. We were out treasure hunting, got jumped by a alpha tiger, and our mated pair of bears (on a somewhat boosted private server) were able to kill it with about 1/2 health still left on both. Made a trip fun that could have been a disaster.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Horse : left click is 12 damage, right click is 14

So..

Rhino : 37 damage, 500 with charge

Elephant : 35 damage

Bear : 35 damage

Giraffe : 35 damage

Wolf : 22 damage (ROFL)

Ostrich : 19 damage

Pig : 12 damage

 

What about the values for lion 🦁  and tiger 🐅 , does anyone know these ?

Razertooth and Shieldthorn ?

Edited by Talono

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Talono said:

Horse : left click is 12 damage, right click is 14

So..

Rhino : 37 damage, 500 with charge

Elephant : 35 damage

Bear : 35 damage

Giraffe : 35 damage

Wolf : 22 damage (ROFL)

Ostrich : 19 damage

Pig : 12 damage

 

What about the values for lion 🦁  and tiger 🐅 , does anyone know these ?

Razertooth and Shieldthorn ?

I can give you the exact damage numbers if I'm home in 3 hours.

But dmg isn't all. Attack speed, cleave range and style matters also for combat.

Razortooth does decent dmg, has a nice cleave range, hits passive with his tail, has a roar who fears small creatures on first use and bigger ones at multiple use, while inceasing the dmg taken, has an group buff roar to increase resistance and dmg of friendly tames and runs incredible fast.  But sadly runs extremly fast out of steam on each action, has low stam, life and weight (ovrall Base stats).

While Shieldhorn is utterly useless. has also weak base stats, runs out of steam fast, is laughable slow, has a weak charge with weak dmg who takes long to charge. Only good use currently is tanking front dmg and being a speed boat on short terms.

 

Lions and shieldhorns are especially useless in pve. Cause Lion can't grab small creatues and shieldhorns can only tank arrow from aod

 

Edited by John Whales

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, John Whales said:

I can give you the exact damage numbers if I'm home in 3 hours.

But dmg isn't all. Attack speed, cleave range and style matters also for combat.

Razortooth does decent dmg, has a nice cleave range, hits passive with his tail, has a roar who fears small creatures on first use and bigger ones at multiple use, while inceasing the dmg taken, has an group buff roar to increase resistance and dmg of friendly tames and runs incredible fast.  But sadly runs extremly fast out of steam on each action, has low stam, life and weight (ovrall Base stats).

While Shieldhorn is utterly useless. has also weak base stats, runs out of steam fast, is laughable slow, has a weak charge with weak dmg who takes long to charge. Only good use currently is tanking front dmg and being a speed boat on short terms.

 

Lions and shieldhorns are especially useless in pve. Cause Lion can't grab small creatues and shieldhorns can only tank arrow from aod

 

Lions could easily be fixed in PvE by letting them grab none-aggressive none-tamed animals for moving (ex: picking up a horse or crow - but not rattle snake as it's aggressive - and moving them to taming pens).

Don't know what to do with shieldhorn in PvE. Maybe extend their dmg reduction in the front to include 90-95% melee?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, John Whales said:

I can give you the exact damage numbers if I'm home in 3 hours.

But dmg isn't all. Attack speed, cleave range and style matters also for combat. 

 

Give DPS reported from target dummy then (includes Attack Speed) and list MD modifier of the tame used.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys, i put all levelups of the pets into HP, is this correct PVP-wise ?

I noticed after placing 15 levelups on my bear into meelee damage he went from 35 per hit to 36... hurrah !!!

HP should grant better benefit, or what do you think ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Talono said:

I noticed after placing 15 levelups on my bear into meelee damage he went from 35 per hit to 36... hurrah !!!

Child's play.

Pure breed from level 30's and imprint 100% THEN dump all level into melee and report DPS and MD% from a dummy as Kummba mentioned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bear: Wild levels 42. Tame levels 31. MD 140.4% Imprint 0%.

LMB: Base = 42 / DPS = 43   RMB: Base = 46 / DPS = 56

 

Edit:  These are numbers from just your avg high level spawn. Affinity affects the value you receive per tamed level too so to min/max you actually need Beastmaster T3 affinity perks, and maybe an affinity scroll even, to perfectly tame breeding material (who's wild levels are RNG so some are better than others) then you need to pure breed them for imprint and so on. If they reintroduce Mutations the rabbit hole goes even deeper. 

This is why I advocate that Bears are OP. Name ONE other tame that once you complete this process has any chance to compete?

Edited by Nari
Elaboration

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I forgot to mention Natures Cry.

Using the first tier alone doubled those numbers. LMB Base 85 / DPS 85 and RMB Base 92 / DPS 112. Tier 2 is just duration but T3 increases damage even further. Don't have it (yet*) so I can't test it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you cant put a defined damage on any animal  its completely subjective....

 

MY bear hits for 147,   not sure how u get 35

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, war machine said:

you cant put a defined damage on any animal  its completely subjective....

 

MY bear hits for 147,   not sure how u get 35

Lol yes you can. Reverse engineer the base stats and then extrapolate with the assumption of 100% affinity. Look up  DodoDex for ARK.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Nari said:

I forgot to mention Natures Cry.

Using the first tier alone doubled those numbers. LMB Base 85 / DPS 85 and RMB Base 92 / DPS 112. Tier 2 is just duration but T3 increases damage even further. Don't have it (yet*) so I can't test it.

I think you're slightly wrong.

T3 is double, T2 is about 50% (I went over T1 so fast I didn't notice if it was 50 too so I'll take your word for it).

19 chocobo hits for about 38, 32 elephant hits for 64.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, gadefence said:

I think you're slightly wrong.

Those are the numbers and numbers don't lie. I posted them right after grabbing highest level 0% imprint bear and beating on a dummy. Then I unlocked Natures Cry one again and tested again.  T1 is a 200% buff and T2 says in it's description that it only affects duration.

Edit2: Lol... You're also not wrong I just tested again, then unlocked T2 and DPS dropped to LMB: DPS 74 RMB: DPS 97

Edit3: First off, I'm starting to think I need glasses 🤣 neither T2 or 3 increase the buff they both only increase duration. Second, after losing DPS I decided to respec. I'm getting different numbers than before with the same bear at the same MD%. Without Cry base is 40 not 56 with RMB and T1 doubles it to 80 not 112. (the same DPS as Edit2 97)

Edit4: Neither T2 or T3 decreased DPS this time after respec. It just lasts longer as intended. Something is fucky tho... A bug or shadow nerf to bear with that update. Maybe the dummy can't be trusted. I know for  a while it was unreliable in ARK. I'm going to keep this bear at 140.4% for testing purposes.

FinalEdit: So I'm not going crazy. With a different bear that has the same MD 140.4% the numbers are the same. Both with and without the buff.

Edited by Nari

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...