This isn't PVE, change it.

[Notorious 67]

6 minutes ago, Vaenix said:

I'm stating very simple that it is an MMO PVE system, and it is not broken because it has player interaction.  You whined about land so I offered solutions.  You whined about people, so I offered solutions. Are there bugs in the system sure but it's not PvA or PvP or whatever made up acronymn you want to use just because it isn't Single Player.  Every MMO has player interaction and sadly some of that is griefing and yes that needs to be addressed and fixed.  But having player interaction alone(which is what your original post entailed people telling you "Good Luck" and not letting you have their land), does not mean that it is no longer PvE.

When a player has option to rent to another player , then has the right to steal your stuff isn't PVE, not talking about player interaction. The renter has  no power to remove his/her belongings and it's all based on a PVP interaction. So above how does this fall under PVE, please explain to me.

[Lynx 92]

24 minutes ago, Notorious said:

When a player has option to rent to another player , then has the right to steal your stuff isn't PVE, not talking about player interaction. The renter has  no power to remove his/her belongings and it's all based on a PVP interaction. So above how does this fall under PVE, please explain to me.

It's not PvE. It's bad game design. Short sighted devs. 

[Kveldulf 32]

36 minutes ago, Vaenix said:

I'm stating very simple that it is an MMO PVE system, and it is not broken because it has player interaction.  You whined about land so I offered solutions.  You whined about people, so I offered solutions. Are there bugs in the system sure but it's not PvA or PvP or whatever made up acronymn you want to use just because it isn't Single Player.  Every MMO has player interaction and sadly some of that is griefing and yes that needs to be addressed and fixed.  But having player interaction alone(which is what your original post entailed people telling you "Good Luck" and not letting you have their land), does not mean that it is no longer PvE.

Vaenix, take a step back for a minute.

He's not saying he wants a single player game.  He likes positive interactions with people.  What he doesn't like is the system as it is gives too much power to the few who prefer negative interactions in which they come out on top.

Engaging in diplomacy and trade is great.  All for it.  But... how many times does one have to do that only to find those with ALL the power just turn around and screw them?  Having taxes is fine, if there is an associated cost to owning the land for the owner him or herself.  Currently, there is not.

A company with 585 flags?  Honestly that seems rather excessive.  Keep in mind, they have literally no cost at all associated with holding all that land and imposing substantial taxes.  Then, on top of that, they're going to demand specific amounts of farming?

That makes a great PvP system.  Absolutely.  Grab the pitch forks and take the little royals to the guillotine.

In PvE though, it simply means the rejects who can't hack it in PvP come and hold dominion over players who were looking for the positive interactions of PvE.

That's the problem.

[Lynx 92]

1 minute ago, Kveldulf said:

PvE though, it simply means the rejects who can't hack it in PvP come and hold dominion over players who were looking for the positive interactions of PvE.

That's the problem.

Exactly. Dominion. nice world choice.

[JC67 38]

All i say is, one player one claim.Land for everyone. If a company have 4 members then you get so put down 4 claims and so on.

[ptonfm 7]

Resource cost to own land?  What a great ENVIRONMENTAL barrier to overcome.  Sounds like it should be in game.  

Taxes to offset owning the land that costs resources to own?  Wow now we are actually, somewhat, playing the video game like a video game.  

(They would have to remove building from lawless to make everything worthwhile)

Do I want them to implement this useless busy system? NO.  

Freaking video game loggin on to pay taxes . lol fun. 

Edited February 4, 2019 by ptonfm

[sand man 99]

13 minutes ago, JC67 said:

All i say is, one player one claim.Land for everyone. If a company have 4 members then you get so put down 4 claims and so on.

1 claim per person, how simple is thats,, Devs hello

[FruitBatCat 70]

3 hours ago, Uueerdo said:

Maybe I am misreading, but I can't help but feel like this is like saying "but what about the plight of millionaires."

Your analogy is bad, in real life we earn money so we don't have to do anything (we don't want to) - we buy games to do something, for entertainment.

Game theory is not rocket science, it's not real life either.

[Winter Thorne 696]

3 hours ago, Uueerdo said:

Maybe I am misreading, but I can't help but feel like this is like saying "but what about the plight of millionaires."

If we were talking about RL I'd agree with you, but, unlike life, there's only so much content you get in a game.  People who chew through all the content in the first 3 months find themselves with nothing left to do.  They begin to badger the devs for "more content", but that's a losing battle.  No dev team can keep up with the really fast players.  In the end (assuming development improvements continue), players who go more slowly  and collect and build their own things will still have plenty to do and enjoy the game longer.

[DocHolliday 366]

I guess that is why I will never understand PvE.  After a year or two are you relegated to moving the furniture around your base for entertainment? 

[Shintai 117]

Upkeep on flags after an x amount of free flags per company is the solution. 1 gold per hour per flag over say 3. Free land everywhere.

[Notorious 67]

6 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

I guess that is why I will never understand PvE.  After a year or two are you relegated to moving the furniture around your base for entertainment? 

For us our goal is to setup trade lines, to beat Cyclops and do the fountain of youth run with full sets of gear. Not suicide runs. Our goal is to beat the ghost ship, tame a dragon and beat the kracken. Our goal is to simply make friends and enjoy the game after a hard day's work. ...If that involves moving my bed to the other side of my base so be it.  It's PVE  To beat the environment and to survive is our main goal. Not losing hundreds of hours to a PVA or PVP environment.

[corpse 13]

7 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

I guess that is why I will never understand PvE.  After a year or two are you relegated to moving the furniture around your base for entertainment? 

The game is only a month old.  They are already talking about putting in new content, and adjusting content that is there already.  While I do not agree with some (many) of the systems in place, I feel that some time to make changes should be allowed.  I'm not a programmer, so I don't really know how it all works.  I seriously doubt that it is as simple as "well, this thing we thought up doesn't work, let's throw something together like the players are suggesting".  A whole new system for land claim will take planning, testing and time.  I think what would help is a little acknowledgment that things are not working and that they are considering a new system.  Making some changes that seem simple to us like one claim per person (which I personally like) might take more time programming.  Don't get me wrong, I am not an apologist for the designers, but we are one month in and they have made some positive changes - it will slowly come together.  I hope.  

[DocHolliday 366]

Ah ok I can see that.  Gaming at a slower pace and looking to improve on your processes and tactics.

Not my thing personally.  I love knowing that at any second a bullet could pierce my dome and I can do the same to anyone else.  Gets the blood pumping.

[Winter Thorne 696]

9 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

I guess that is why I will never understand PvE.  After a year or two are you relegated to moving the furniture around your base for entertainment? 

In a badly designed game, that's what usually happens, and usually sooner than 2 years.  A good pve design needs good core systems and the systems need a lot of depth .  If you had a game with exploration, meaningful crafting, player competition through city systems with economics, diplomacy, politics and trade, along with changes the players could make to the entire game world through massive cooperative efforts, then you'd give people enough to do for quite a long time.  The problem happens when a developer goes for breadth instead of depth and throws little doodads at the game in an attempt to keep people interested, rather than fully developing bigger systems.

Usually if you see "we're adding quests!", in a game that's fully released, that's a pretty good danger sign that development is either lazy or lacks imagination.

[boomervoncannon 1,541]

6 hours ago, Uueerdo said:

Maybe I am misreading, but I can't help but feel like this is like saying "but what about the plight of millionaires."

No actually what he's saying is games are about overcoming challenges. When you have someone else acheive things for you ingame, you are robbing yourself of the experience. It isn't about sympathy for millionaires, it's about the psychology of game design and basic motivations. If I handed you an Olympic gold medal, beyond the price value of the metal in it, would it mean much to you if you didn't earn it?

I would bet dollars to donuts that the folks sitting on their arses lettting their tax banks accumulate vast resources for them may very well be some of the first ones to post here saying in effect "we're bored, there's nothing to do, this game doesn't have any @#%$ing content. Devs get off your arses and make us some content." What they missed was that they shortcutted part of the natural content of the game, accelerating themselves towards boredom.

Edited February 5, 2019 by boomervoncannon

[Uueerdo 9]

1 hour ago, boomervoncannon said:

No actually what he's saying is games are about overcoming challenges. When you have someone else acheive things for you ingame, you are robbing yourself of the experience. It isn't about sympathy for millionaires, it's about the psychology of game design and basic motivations. If I handed you an Olympic gold medal, beyond the price value of the metal in it, would it mean much to you if you didn't earn it?

I would bet dollars to donuts that the folks sitting on their arses lettting their tax banks accumulate vast resources for them may very well be some of the first ones to post here saying in effect "we're bored, there's nothing to do, this game doesn't have any @#%$ing content. Devs get off your arses and make us some content." What they missed was that they shortcutted part of the natural content of the game, accelerating themselves towards boredom.

Seemed to me he was saying was that he feels sorrier for the players who got in on the land rush, built up, and ran through the content (and are now sitting around occupying land they have no need for) than he does for the landless players who have a hard time even reaching the content there is because there is barely any land to even stage themselves from.

[Uueerdo 9]

4 hours ago, FruitBatCat said:

Your analogy is bad, in real life we earn money so we don't have to do anything (we don't want to) - we buy games to do something, for entertainment.

Game theory is not rocket science, it's not real life either.

Metaphors don't have to be exact, and I'm not sure where you got the idea I was confusing Atlas with real life; I just think it is odd you think the plight of people who have run out of content is greater than that of the people that can't experience it because the former is sitting on the resources (land and actual resources) the latter actually needs to even experience the content in the first place.

[duque 14]

How sad, when you have land and taxes, nothing happens, but the one who loses the land because he did not connect to prevent them from appropriating it is an injustice, stop being hypocrites and later find land for 3 weeks and I have 8 flags, 12 hours late in making me with the properties alone, the one that does not have land is because he did not want it or he did not want to waste time, the fashion of the last years is to have everything that the game offers without BENDING , do not want to pay taxes. Have the base on the boat or on the islands without law, if simple, and stop crying for lands that you lost in PVE due to not being connected

[provokatze23 1]

I agree you to 100%. 

I wanted to play pve, but after our base got 2x stolen in PVE i left that game. 

If they offer pve and pvp they should make it that it works for both game modes... 

maybe doing trading in pve, limit that fk landclaims and make a decaytimer of bases like in ark. 

 Wont come back as long as it is how it is. 

[Ban Tier 29]

12 hours ago, Shintai said:

Upkeep on flags after an x amount of free flags per company is the solution. 1 gold per hour per flag over say 3. Free land everywhere.

Almost a good idea. Make it one free flag per 5 company members and cap it at 10 free flags. That would reflect company size and free up a lot of land.

[Puppies4ever 856]

I have my main base in lawless. It is a Tame & Trade Base since release. I meet so many people via trading and a lot of them offer me claims for free. I think its important who you are and what you want. I see too many people screaming "Any free land here?" and i always ask myself why someone should give them a claim? Explain people what your goal is. When i join a square i introduce myself and offer my tames, seeds etc. Many people are interested and go in contact with me. I visit their base to handover the tames and we are talking about everything and people offer me one claim, because they know that im not a "rude intruder".............

Its one simple thing: People should feel that they won a new neighbor and not that they lost a claim.

Sry for my poor english.

[FruitBatCat 70]

14 hours ago, Winter Thorne said:

If we were talking about RL I'd agree with you, but, unlike life, there's only so much content you get in a game.  People who chew through all the content in the first 3 months find themselves with nothing left to do.  They begin to badger the devs for "more content", but that's a losing battle.  No dev team can keep up with the really fast players.  In the end (assuming development improvements continue), players who go more slowly  and collect and build their own things will still have plenty to do and enjoy the game longer.

 

12 hours ago, boomervoncannon said:

No actually what he's saying is games are about overcoming challenges. When you have someone else acheive things for you ingame, you are robbing yourself of the experience. It isn't about sympathy for millionaires, it's about the psychology of game design and basic motivations. If I handed you an Olympic gold medal, beyond the price value of the metal in it, would it mean much to you if you didn't earn it?

I would bet dollars to donuts that the folks sitting on their arses lettting their tax banks accumulate vast resources for them may very well be some of the first ones to post here saying in effect "we're bored, there's nothing to do, this game doesn't have any @#%$ing content. Devs get off your arses and make us some content." What they missed was that they shortcutted part of the natural content of the game, accelerating themselves towards boredom.

 

10 hours ago, Uueerdo said:

Metaphors don't have to be exact, and I'm not sure where you got the idea I was confusing Atlas with real life; I just think it is odd you think the plight of people who have run out of content is greater than that of the people that can't experience it because the former is sitting on the resources (land and actual resources) the latter actually needs to even experience the content in the first place.

@Uueerdo Tbh my explanation didn't make much sense to even me when I read it this morning lol, luckily 2 other more sober posters stepped in to clear up the confusion, I refer to their better explanations of my point.

Basically I'm saying it's bad game design where everyone in the system loses.

[Winter Thorne 696]

9 minutes ago, FruitBatCat said:

 

 

@Uueerdo Tbh my explanation didn't make much sense to even me when I read it this morning lol, luckily 2 other more sober posters stepped in to clear up the confusion, I refer to their better explanations of my point.

Basically I'm saying it's bad game design where everyone in the system loses.

Hey, who are you calling sober?

[ptonfm 7]

9 hours ago, duque said:

Have the base on the boat or on the islands without law, if simple, and stop crying for lands that you lost in PVE due to not being connected

Don't complain you are losing to other PvE PLAYERS in your PVE Game.  Because that would mean it's really PvP if you are fighting other PLAYERS over your PvE.