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Shakarian

Mixed PVP/PVE Official servers replacing lawless zones.

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To Grapeshot.  Your community has created servers which actually mix PVP servers and PVE servers on 1 map.  PVE usually existing around equatorial and tropical zones, while desert, temperate and tundra are PVP.  This allows all players of all play styles to play together with very little issue.  Each zone server is set up independently, incorporating PVE or PVP settings, and I think they have a superior idea.  It opens more of the map to claimable space as well, removing any need for lawless zones, which take up a ridiculous amount of official servers.  Having the PVE zone around the middle zones allows easy movement to PVP areas where certain resources are needed, without having to extend themselves too far into hostile territory, plus not many PVP players are just kos, so the danger risk of quick resource trips is actually pretty low.  It also gives PVP players the ability to help subsidize the PVE economy, by bringing in those less common resources to PVE players, without the ability to attack.  There's also the potential for hiring ships and captains for escort protection to power stone and Fountain of Youth locations.  Whole new dynamics and ways to play, all while extinguishing the lawless zones made unnecessary by neutral, everyone can build, claims.

I understand these would constitute big changes, requiring some map changing as well as reassigning each server to PVP or PVE settings, but overall I think it would be a good move in the long run.  4 Public Official servers, all open to everyone, as well as each new server cluster you add to the list as the game's player base continues to grow.

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Very nice concept, very similar to EVE. I hope that they will consider such a server, but i am afraid that they wont as logical stuff is not on their list.

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I do think some PVP areas existing within PVE servers is a good idea. I think resource destruction in eve really drove the economy.

 

I don't think they should be required to ever enter the pvp zones to access all of the content in the game though. there shouldn't be FoY or powerstones behind them.

I don't think existing zones should be repurposed. maybe a 4 freeports could turn into 4 "war zones". put in fun prizes for getting the mguffins out successfully so people enjoy it, but don't make the pvp elements something you have to deal with basically ever if you don't want to.

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I'd like to see Nation vs Nation (aka Realm vs Realm) as the PvP in a PvP/PvE set-up. Never been a big fan of the Eve model which replaces factions with large guilds.

Nation vs. Nation is better in my opinion for small groups as you are not at the beck and call of larger guilds, and can contribute in your own way.

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6 hours ago, Shakarian said:

plus not many PVP players are just kos,

haha, nice one

Atlas already have a system kind of similar to eve, just terribly unbalanced and it surely needs a lot of work.

Official PvE has too many problems with claims (because those were designed with PvP in mind) and i don't think we need those problems on PvP. Especially since the megas will immediately claim all the PvE land and no one will be able to take it from them, ever. A proper highsec should be no-build no-claim basic-resources-only, basically freeports without the stupid decay, with some safe storage and maybe public shipyards. Claiming system is there for PvP companies to fight over something, lawless is there to gather special resources with some risk involved (because good luck doing that on a claimed land) and to allow people who don't feel like joining a mega to build stuff if they like building stuff. If anything we just need more land, lawless or not.

 

Edited by LaiTash

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This is honestly the answer to making a much more robust and enjoyable experience for all. The game really has potential to become one of the greatest MMO experiences on the market. But they need to make some changes that guide it in this direction. The developers have said they lack the talent and skill-set to put a descent AI into the game so PvE squares could certainly bridge that game in a quick fix way. Which seems to be how they fix things anyway...

I made a few threads about it with more detail about the concept. 

1. Atlas Needs Less Ark and More Eve

2. PvPvE Servers - Unofficial Servers Improving the Game Design

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The main issue is (i know that all the trolls will be triggered now) :

- all of your ships will be stolen or sunk when you log in the next day

- all of your nerfed stones bases will be raided offline (if you are lucky and live on the 24% islands with Sap). This is super easy and cost nothing after the stone nerf

- this is no fun for casual players. Yes, a risk is ok if you sail into PVP by intention. But you are online, aware of the danger and can fight back

Losing everything to lolstompers offline is no fun and stupid.

The suggested model would fully solve this issue.

Edited by Talono

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In the reference to EVE, I wore an asshat for a while. Stealth bomber living in a wormhole.  Blew up this hauler one day doing his PI. He said, "Do you realize, that if it weren't for people like me, you wouldn't have ships."  And I replied, "Do you realize that if it weren't for people like me, you'd have nobody to build ships for."

The beauty of Eve was, you could just chill and go mining in high sec if you liked.  You could run PVE missions. You could be that asshat blowing up people in wormholes. You could be a real pirate, holding people for ransom in low sec. Or, you could be a warrior with a cause to fight for in 0.0 doing fleet battles.

I'd love to see Atlas like that, choosing whether to wear your helmet, your fedora or your hard-hat today.

Edited by Jean Lafitte
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Everyone would just live in the PVE area with little to no risk for anything. It would be abused / exploited.

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Completely wrong. For valuables you have to sail into PVP and take the risk, just like in EVE.

But you are not automatic-freeport-tree-puncher when you log in the next day.

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1 minute ago, Talono said:

Completely wrong. For valuables you have to sail into PVP and take the risk, just like in EVE.

But you are not automatic-freeport-tree-puncher when you log in the next day.

There would be no point living in the PVP area. And when PVP does happen everyone would just run for the PVE server and be fine. On top of that people would just sit and camp the server lines and soon as you cross over you would be sunk by time you could do anything. 

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Just now, labatts said:

There would be no point living in the PVP area. And when PVP does happen everyone would just run for the PVE server and be fine. On top of that people would just sit and camp the server lines and soon as you cross over you would be sunk by time you could do anything. 

I've you've never played Eve then you have no idea how wrong this is.  In order to build higher tier items, you needed resources only available in higher risk areas. Risk vs reward.  

Did people run for PVE? Yep. Did they always make it?  Oh hell no.  Were there gate camps? Hell yes.  All the time? No.  Again, risk vs reward.  Could you get through a camp? Yes. A ship called a blockade runner did pretty well at that. Humm... an idea for Atlas perhaps?

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Jean Lafitte said:

I've you've never played Eve then you have no idea how wrong this is.  In order to build higher tier items, you needed resources only available in higher risk areas. Risk vs reward.  

Did people run for PVE? Yep. Did they always make it?  Oh hell no.  Were there gate camps? Hell yes.  All the time? No.  Again, risk vs reward.  Could you get through a camp? Yes. A ship called a blockade runner did pretty well at that. Humm... an idea for Atlas perhaps?

 

 

No I have not played EVE. So then you are watering down the pvp experience to just ship battles then. Sounds quite boring and limited. 

Edited by labatts
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A Colossal No.

Keep your PVE ideas out of PVP. There is no room for safe zones or other core PVE crap on a PVP server. The game already has freeports which are bad enough, we don't need any more.

If your idea was to be implemented everyone would end up parking their ships and storing their loot in the safe zone where it would be untouchable. I've seen other games try and this and they have failed hard. Dark and Light experimented with near unraidable bases and now that game has 300 players. Some private Conan Exile servers had areas where it was strictly PVE, the end result everyone stashed their loot their and the servers became beyond pointless. ARK had unofficial servers with raid timers and safe zones which also would rarely last a month before failing.

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37 minutes ago, labatts said:

Everyone would just live in the PVE area with little to no risk for anything. It would be abused / exploited.

 

19 minutes ago, labatts said:

There would be no point living in the PVP area. And when PVP does happen everyone would just run for the PVE server and be fine. On top of that people would just sit and camp the server lines and soon as you cross over you would be sunk by time you could do anything. 

In theory one could think that. But hauling goods over vast distances into PVE was not an easy task.

So, yes, there will be bases to attack and raid in PVP and there will be valuable stuff inside.

The difference to the current Atlas PVP is just offline troll protection.

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Just now, Talono said:

 

In theory one could think that. But hauling goods over vast distances into PVE was not an easy task.

So, yes, there will be bases to attack and raid in PVP and there will be valuable stuff inside.

The difference to the current Atlas PVP is just offline troll protection.

But this is why we play PVP server we do not want the PVE aspect. There would be no pvp bases like what @bullet face wrote everyone would just use pve area it would be pointless

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7 minutes ago, labatts said:

No I have not played EVE. So then you are watering down the pvp experience to just ship battles then. Sounds quite boring and limited. 

It's a casual gamers perfect dream. Easy risk free gameplay with a reset button.

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1 minute ago, Bullet Force said:

It's a casual gamers perfect dream. Easy risk free gameplay with a reset button.

Oh i totally agree with you, and hope it does not happen.  Its bad enough that the devs are already caving in and going to implement some type of ORP in march

Edited by labatts
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25 minutes ago, labatts said:

There would be no point living in the PVP area. And when PVP does happen everyone would just run for the PVE server and be fine. On top of that people would just sit and camp the server lines and soon as you cross over you would be sunk by time you could do anything. 

Yep. I've seen this happen numerous times in other games when you had the PVE crowd intrude on PVP servers with their demands. The end result is always the same, a stale dead and pointless server where everyone is filthy rich and combat comes down to fixed battle where you tell the other guy to meet you at a certain spot for 'PVP'. :classic_rolleyes:

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22 minutes ago, Jean Lafitte said:

I've you've never played Eve then you have no idea how wrong this is.  In order to build higher tier items, you needed resources only available in higher risk areas. Risk vs reward.  

Did people run for PVE? Yep. Did they always make it?  Oh hell no.  Were there gate camps? Hell yes.  All the time? No.  Again, risk vs reward.  Could you get through a camp? Yes. A ship called a blockade runner did pretty well at that. Humm... an idea for Atlas perhaps?

 

 

I've spent many hours in EVE and you are correct EVE has a proper risk and reward system. Noobs can stay in the Hi Sec safe areas but even there they aren't completely safe and those zones are no where near as lucrative as Low Sec or Null Sec.

7 minutes ago, Talono said:

 

In theory one could think that. But hauling goods over vast distances into PVE was not an easy task.

So, yes, there will be bases to attack and raid in PVP and there will be valuable stuff inside.

The difference to the current Atlas PVP is just offline troll protection.

So you are basically suggesting some kind of fake, false PVP where basically both sides agree to fight for the sake of fighting, rather then for a greater strategic goal. You are basically wanting the game to become like some generic multiplayer RPG game where you spend 99% of your time smashing AI mobs and you only fight other players in special dedicated arenas where there are no consequences to losing save for pride.

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You need to play Eve and understand Eve to truly understand why the PvPvE (Low Sec, High Sec) design works to not just create more PvP, but better PvP. 

It's a game that has had multiple world wars. Have a read

This game stands to be incredible. But it needs the foresight to know it needs to be more than it is now. 

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I wonder how many people complained that this was too much like a certain game in the beginning but now its just fine to make it like another game because they want it.

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