PvE Claim Flag concerns with Latest Update

[Ravenguard 37]

16 minutes ago, Notorious said:

2 weeks is way to much Jat, please dont change it to that long. Make it so people have to work for it. So why not do this. Buy an NPC if your going on holidays. Have gold and make Jerky to feed that NPC, in the cooking tree there will be stuff to craft that will make your food last 2 weeks if your going on holidays. This way a person has to at least put in some effort to keep land for 2 weeks if they don't log in. NPC can stay active as long as it has food and gold. This is fair and to me makes everyone happy. NPC will act as a player that way your land is safe while your on holidays.

Then everyone does it and no land would be claimable then.

[Pax 83]

21 minutes ago, Notorious said:

2 weeks is way to much Jat, please dont change it to that long. Make it so people have to work for it. So why not do this. Buy an NPC if your going on holidays. Have gold and make Jerky to feed that NPC, in the cooking tree there will be stuff to craft that will make your food last 2 weeks if your going on holidays. This way a person has to at least put in some effort to keep land for 2 weeks if they don't log in. NPC can stay active as long as it has food and gold. This is fair and to me makes everyone happy. NPC will act as a player that way your land is safe while your on holidays.

This is already going to be added per Jats notes,

[MeatSammich 214]

7 hours ago, Pax said:

 

@Jathal This is needed 100%

Let me add my agreement to this. Annoying to have to find someone outside your company or alliance to check your timers for you.

(In reference to being able to see your own claim timers)

Edited January 30, 2019 by MeatSammich
clarification

[Notorious 67]

4 minutes ago, Ravenguard said:

Then everyone does it and no land would be claimable then.

If a person put in that much effort they can keep the land, most gamers are to lazy to even cook food.

[Coanunn 0]

Just a thought, but they have routinely said this is likely temporary, so why the hell are there 7 pages of argument over a bandaid instead of discussion around a more permanent fix such as having to pay upkeep on land you claim?  Limited number of claims per player, or some other form of claim system?  It seems ludicrous to complain about what they admit is a knee jerk bandaid reaction to the fact that there are literally companies of 1-5 people controlling multiple islands leaving no room for other players to so much as build a drydock in order to build a ship even in a 30% taxed area.  I mean let's be blunt, right now with less than half the features in the game, it kind of sucks and is making more money for server hosts than it is for Grapeshot.  We all know this is a work in progress so why argue about the bandaid instead of offering player feedback on a preferred system?

[Shintai 117]

35 minutes ago, Notorious said:

2 weeks is way to much Jat, please dont change it to that long. Make it so people have to work for it. So why not do this. Buy an NPC if your going on holidays. Have gold and make Jerky to feed that NPC, in the cooking tree there will be stuff to craft that will make your food last 2 weeks if your going on holidays. This way a person has to at least put in some effort to keep land for 2 weeks if they don't log in. NPC can stay active as long as it has food and gold. This is fair and to me makes everyone happy. NPC will act as a player that way your land is safe while your on holidays.

People have lives to attend to. Playing video games isn´t a job.

[Notorious 67]

14 minutes ago, Shintai said:

People have lives to attend to. Playing video games isn´t a job.

So your telling me putting gold and food in a NPC is to much effort ?

[X is Next 4]

Need to fix this 4 hour claim timer because I definitely have better shit to do than sit in 1 spot for 4 hours I want to play the game not babysit a damn flag.

[Shakarian 31]

12 hours ago, UDO said:

There are some PvE specific changes we want to make as soon as possible. First of all, we want to create two server options, which will be enabled on our Official Network.

•  Sleeping/logged off players will no longer be replicated on any grid (similarly to Freeports). This should improve server and client performance, as well reduce some cases of griefing.
• Force destruction of any character that hasn’t been logged onto in 3 weeks (2 weeks if it’s a Homeserver).

We’ll also be fixing a bug which allowed sleeping characters to contest claims, even if the claim has been inactive, so going forward only logged in characters will be able to contest claims.

this is bullshit 3 day timers on flags already and now logged out bodies will no longer contest claims ,

 

how are we meant to have holidays ? do they really think players take their pcs on holiday with them to log in 

 

logged out player by all means contest the flags but yes after 3 weeks they are gone , we need to have a certain amount of protection for going awauy on holiday 

 

are these devs for real do they have any idea about real life activities ???????

 

please dont bother replying with 3 day is long enough protection , if u cant take pc to  log in every 3 days when on holiday u deserve to lose your claim , dont reply if u r are no life 24/7 hermit gamer either who hasnt seen sun in years 

What about holiday weekends including extended offline protection in addition to increased rates?  Wouldn't be hard to do.  You're very quick to cry.

[UDO 361]

40 minutes ago, Notorious said:

So your telling me putting gold and food in a NPC is to much effort ?

this wasnt in the patch notes , this was added later after the shit had hit the fan, so no good quoting stuff that isnt in any patch notes , 

 

also why are all flags showing 2 day countdown ? every flag ive been to from players that have logged in today all showing 1 day 20 odd hours ?

[Lorien 9]

9 hours ago, Jatheish said:

We're going to be making a change to PvE claims so that the inactivity timer starts at a base of 2 weeks instead of 3 days. Additionally, if you are a person/group with a larger amount of claims, the amount of inactivity timer you have will scale with that and have a lower limit of 3 days. So large companies with multiple flags have less amount of time where their base can be inactive versus those with just a few flags. We'll think on having a minimum before the number starts shrinking, or perhaps it'll just be 1 flag = 2 weeks. These numbers may not be exact and might change by the time we deploy, but that's the general idea. Hoping to get this out to you guys tomorrow. This may not be the perfect/most optimal solution, but we'll go ahead and make this change until we have thought more on our claim design for the overall game.

TLDR:

- Inactive claim timer will cap at 2 weeks, and bottom out at 3 days based on the number of claims you have

- Sleeping players won't contest claims

- NPC Crew can contest claims, but you'll have to feed and pay them otherwise they'll mutiny!

This might be a temporary change as we further evaluate how we want the claim system to work, especially with our new philosophy in mind.

May I sugest we can look at our flag and see our self what that time is?

[Defixio 26]

I would love to know what our timers are by looking them over.

[Asanna 86]

Any word on the abuse/exploit of the nooks and cranny placements that are overlapping half claimed areas?

 

Normal players see "there is an enemy claim near by, place your flag inside theirs to contest" yet some people found a way around this.

[Winter Thorne 696]

12 hours ago, MaxPower said:

You're worried about what happens if you go on vacation. So lets say you go on vacation for two weeks.... should you be allowed to occupy part of the game world for two weeks when you're not even playing? 
 

Yes, you should.  Everybody is "not playing" for some part of their lives.  You might as well ask, "Should you be allowed to occupy part of the game world while you're sleeping..at work..at school...eating dinner?"   The real question is whether you're a player of the game or not.  Since people who really are players really will go on vacations, business trips, into the hospital, etc., there's no good reason to grab all their stuff just because they're doing that.

It's reasonable to grab back land (and other) assets from a player who has abandoned the game.  2 weeks is not enough time to say that a player has abandoned the game.  I wouldn't give it MUCH more than that, but you sure can't say that player is gone after 2 weeks.  20 days might be ok.  Consider a player who has played the game for a year and a half, has countless amount of hours, has a shop, done some beautiful building, a good rep among the other players, etc.  Who has more of a right to all their stuff if they go on a 2 week vacation?  Them?  Or some guy who started yesterday and might quit next week?

[Telly 8]

7 hours ago, Dumb1Bunny said:

Old flags don't get the 3 day timer...at all. The only reason I have mine is because I sleep there. So yeah I might get off work to no base at all. Guaranteed I am done with the game if I lost everything while I am at work.

Where did you read/hear this? I couldn't find anything indicating the changes will only affect new flags.

[Ganelot 3]

Well I got back from work.. My ship is here but base is gone flag is claimed (wasn't mine it was some random that let me build there) so gg... Only ship left all my stuff is gone... 

[asmodyus 4]

14 hours ago, Jatheish said:

We're currently evaluating our claim system and seeing what changes we can make to improve it across the board, as it definitely needs work. It's arguable that the 3 day timer may need to be increased now that we no longer allow sleeping bodies to contest claims, but due to the limited amount of land available and how PvE servers work we have to put measures in place to make sure that land cannot be sat on indefinitely. 

Players can still use Crew (which are to be fed and paid) to contest claims. The sleeping measure we put in place was more so to tackle users who hadn't logged on in days and hadn't planned to but were still contesting their inactive claims because their bodies had not died.

 

Stop Allowing companies so claim territory do you know how much territory out there is not being used people are just sitting on it for the hell of it and logging in ever so often to keep it.

[FruitBatCat 70]

What a thread! After reading all this all I can say is...

Rent and taxes have no place in PVE unless it's paid to the game as a resource / gold sink. Make all PVE zones lawless or restrict land claims to reasonable levels so people can only claim to play on that land, not claim to gain something from other players or restrict other player's options. Do it soon.

Edited January 30, 2019 by FruitBatCat

[Zelloss 5]

agreed!  This game is pretty amazing, please do not make it so its literally just griefing over land. :(    So much of the map locked out by ppl who just want to own and keep others from playing.  Just watch a few streamers play and you'll see the headache it causes.   Im glad the devs are re-evaluating the system,  In my humble option maybe have two different sets of rules based on server might make sense yeah?  What works for pvp DOESN'T always work for pve.   I still say only ONE claim per person. want more?  recruit more ppl then.   Maybe have a option to turn off claims on the maps, as well as the claim messages (tired of seeing racist messages while playing)  Please. 

Other then that Im loving this game, and honestly can not wait for upcoming content!!  :)

[Tobekan 28]

Moving to an unofficial server was the best thing I've done.  It's a much better experience.  Same was true for Ark.

[Kirves 45]

@Jatheish Not sure if this has already been asked or answered so sorry in advance. But is there a chance we can personally see the upkeep timer on our own flags? As of right now I either need a stranger to place a flag by mine to tell me. Or I would have to get another account and do it.

[Izavar 0]

First off, quick question:

To keep a claim active, do you just need to log in and touch the claim? Or, do you just need to log in anywhere? 

Or, have a character (or soon NPC, it sounds like) logged in sleeping in the claim?

 

On Time a Claim is uncapturable:

Two weeks for me is the right max  claim duration for a solo player who has been inactive (not logged into the game). Especially, if all I have to do is log in once and suddently my timer resets for another two weeks.

For me, during periods of inactivity, I can't imagine a two week period where I wouldn't be able to log in for 5 minutes and refresh my timer. If I can't, then I NEED to lose land, especially in a game whose major crux is persistent land claiming. I've rarely taken two week holidays in my entire life (I'm 47). If the game eventually provides an additional mechanic of feeding and paying an NPC to hold claims longer in those rare times I might, I really have a hard time arguing that I need more time. At that point, it should be on me to hand the claim to a trusted active neighbor who could hand it back when I returned. Or, to join a Company. 

Three days as a bottom end for a company with multiple claims ALSO feels right to me, especially if all they need to do is have SOMEONE touch the claim. It literally takes about an hour to build a small stone hut (even with new stone costs) and place a bed in it that anyone in your company can teleport to. Seriously, how hard is it to pop over to remote claims you wish to hold?  If you can't be bothered, then you are an asshole greedy landholder and you SHOULD lose your territory in a game that has a serious real estate problem.

 

On time to capture a claim:

4 hours seems like a really long time. I've captured a PvE claim that took 9 hours already. Of me actively standing around in the claim. It was 6 hours, and then people kept touching the claim borders and adding 20-30 minutes back every time they crossed the claim. They weren't intending to contest the claim, they just wandered through.  I really wish that Contesting a claim had some kind of confirmation with it, so passers by couldn't accidentally complicate your efforts.

That said - I would hate for it to be much shorter. I've spent days building structures on my land, and I would hate accidentally losing a claim because I didn't realize how short our claim timers had become.

 

All of this exploration seems to be steps in the correct direction. Honestly, I think the biggest design philosophy here should be basically this:  If you are generally active in the game and don't hold a disproportionately large amount of land, and no one comes to forcibly take it from you (PvP), then it shouldn't be hard to hold on to. 1-2 claims per active individual in a company should be fairly easy to hold without aggressive actions.

If you and your buddy claimed 30 areas because you got out of the Freeport before the rest of us on launch day, and you still haven't made it available to others-- your reckoning is coming, and it is deserved.

[schio248 2]

Almost all of the Land that became available after the patch is already claimed by companies that just "expanded" their previous claims they had on the same island. Stop letting people claim unlimited lands, so new players have a chance to claim something decent too. There are entire island that are completely claimed by companies with less than 3 players, because they just spammed all the land that became available. Why do the dev's not see these kind of problems, before they implement something. Do they actually have game designers? Actually it's just common sense.

[Daish 24]

18 hours ago, Shintai said:

Technically it is now safer on a lawless island due to 4 days instead of 3 on claimed. And they mentioned how they was going to help solo and small companies. Oh the irony.

lol yep dont play for 2 days = lose everything you own 

[Taiine 19]

@Jatheish

Can there be a fix some time that stops people from foundation spamming our claimed land? 

We were given two flag's worth of land by a large company but another company next to us even with our flag set to company and allies only have been able to come over and foundation spam pretty much our whole area, even right next to our flag. I've already put in a report on this but it's getting pretty stupid that we can't even use our land.