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morph489

Claiming Needs Fixing otherwise Atlas Is Sunk

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Does anyone know if the devs have any plans for claiming......at the moment the system is so bad its basically forcing me to play other games

For example I sail around for several hours,,,,,which in itself is boring as fuck because you find companies have not 10 flags, or 20 flags, or even 50....no no some have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, so load up a better game to play while atlas sails in background.....find some land that looks promising....land and find 2-3 companies that have claimed everything.....the mountains, the beachs, the forests and the islands......you cant build anything there, and have to wander around finding a place that they haven't been in for a while......once you find it you set down a claim flag which then tells you its going to be 3 hours to claim....you cant build anything and gathering anything helps your enemy though the taxation system.....So then you log off and play anouther game for 3 hours...…

I think the devs need to help new players coming to the game.....esp as other mmo have know caught on too rule number 1 for MMO "If people can shit on each other......they will shit on each other"

I think a better system would be dependable on player count in company and having tiers of claims.....so for example a personal claim would be very small barely 20-25 feet across......a company of 5 or more has 50 feet and a company with 20 has 100 feet and so on and so on. And obvsiouly each company has only 1 claim...….therefore meaning new players have places to setup and build them selves up and bigger companies can expand without claiming everything by recruitment


Hopefully there get it sorted.....at the moment going off atlas and back to other games 
 

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Lots of new games coming out all the time, people will move on to other games.

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1 minute ago, Lynx said:

Lots of new games coming out all the time, people will move on to other games.

That's not the problem.  I have been waiting for a spot to open up (which I have been building on) for a month.  The owner stopped playing after 4-5 days and has been sleeping in his house.  I cannot claim the land because he's sleeping inside.  PvE claiming is near impossible if you're looking to take land.  So, if people quit, it will just lock up the land until that person dies from being away from the game, and we have no idea how long that is.

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The thing that I like about the Op’s Suggestion is how it will not only be a more reasonable approach to the problem of finite land, but his proposed suggestion will indirectly help address other things as well. What I mean is that for several problems the solution has been put forward to cap company size at X. It keeps getting pointed out that this approach won’t work because large companies will just use alliances to circumvent the cap. The Op’s suggestion creates a strong negative consequence to using alliances in this manner.

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Just checked it again, all land is held by companies using the daisy chain overlapping claim circle bug.

So, if you place a flag it is 100% contested and each try is auto-fail.

Well at least we have sap as stone component now, which is not available on my island,

Asked my chemist if the recipe for stone is logical in any way ? Now i sit in a rubber cell for the mental damaged😒

Edited by Talono

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1 hour ago, boomervoncannon said:

The thing that I like about the Op’s Suggestion is how it will not only be a more reasonable approach to the problem of finite land, but his proposed suggestion will indirectly help address other things as well. What I mean is that for several problems the solution has been put forward to cap company size at X. It keeps getting pointed out that this approach won’t work because large companies will just use alliances to circumvent the cap. The Op’s suggestion creates a strong negative consequence to using alliances in this manner.

Another quick suggestion would be to just add some more islands. Plenty of space in the sea and hours of travel to the next best thing. I am busy today so I would be able to respond as much.

i get they want a lot of water, well they have a lot of water. They could afford to add extra islands and believe me there would still be plenty of sea.

yes claims need fixing of course but there does need to be more land in general

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I dont know where you are looking but their is always land in the lawless islands and their are heaps of them.

Also their is land available or do you mean just not land available where you want it.

As I found a bunch of plots of land with resources on them. I checked 3 islands in the north found more land than I could ever use.

Edited by Orionadie

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7 minutes ago, Realist said:

Another quick suggestion would be to just add some more islands. Plenty of space in the sea and hours of travel to the next best thing. I am busy today so I would be able to respond as much.

i get they want a lot of water, well they have a lot of water. They could afford to add extra islands and believe me there would still be plenty of sea.

yes claims need fixing of course but there does need to be more land in general

The addition of submarines and an underwater biome leaves me suspecting that a long term goal is to make underwater a lot more useful than just harvesting shipwrecks and a few mats, but it is only a hunch. More islands wouldn't hurt either.

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30 minutes ago, Realist said:

Another quick suggestion would be to just add some more islands. Plenty of space in the sea and hours of travel to the next best thing. I am busy today so I would be able to respond as much.

i get they want a lot of water, well they have a lot of water. They could afford to add extra islands and believe me there would still be plenty of sea.

yes claims need fixing of course but there does need to be more land in general

Imagine the lag with even more stuff to render.

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32 minutes ago, Orionadie said:

I dont know where you are looking but their is always land in the lawless islands and their are heaps of them.

Also their is land available or do you mean just not land available where you want it.

As I found a bunch of plots of land with resources on them. I checked 3 islands in the north found more land than I could ever use.

Each sector with 5 islands requires like 4 GB of RAM and 1-2 dedicated CPUs to run. Their server software is so janky and poorly optimized they would sacrifice too much profit to accommodate a good game play experience.

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24 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

The addition of submarines and an underwater biome leaves me suspecting that a long term goal is to make underwater a lot more useful than just harvesting shipwrecks and a few mats, but it is only a hunch. More islands wouldn't hurt either.

Even though an Atlantis style area and base setting would be good(I do agree), believe me the “pirates” are going to be so pissed off lol.

they tried the whole tek tier underwater set up and ruined it. Personally I was pretty disappointed in that since I liked water tames a lot. Gave more of a challenge.

i really hope they don’t try to implement underwater bases(even though I like them) because they will not execute it well. Since they don’t have tek(hope to fing god) in this game it would have to be some sort of magic, which of course hasn’t been introduced yet. So it would be a good long while before Atlantis would be around. 

Yes, one day I would like to see it but they would be complete idiots to try to implement it even in the next 6 months. 

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10 minutes ago, Lynx said:

Imagine the lag with even more stuff to render.

Oh yeah I am with you on that man. It just seems like an easier fix then them trying to fix a stupid idea like claiming in the first place. 

They literally got it right with ark. Build anywhere and get raided anywhere. I will always say claims were stupid. They really are stupid. Yes they wanted to be new, it didn’t work, throw it in the garbage and let people build anywhere(besides the usual span for ark). It would solve the problem. I promise that.

but believe me these guys like adding content instead of fixing so it would benefit everyone to just add more islands instead of trying to fix a dumb idea like claiming. I smh at it when I first heard about it and sure enough there it is.

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IMO more islands  = more space for the land grabbers / exploiters / greedy players who currently control it all now. Giving them more room to expand does not seem like a good answer.

OP's suggestion about limiting the size of a claim by the number of "Active" personnel they have is a very fair and logical approach to this problem.  Large companies could potentially still control a large chunk of land but they would either all have to remain active players or continually recruit new blood to keep up the land.

To expand upon that you could also count the number of tenants they have on the land towards the size of the claim, the more you got people wise the more space you will need. Giving them the incentive to treat their tenants more fairly and not charging extreme tax rates or changing the rules to evict/steal peoples stuff. Word gets out you are a lousy landlord and you wont have no tenants usually if you are that kind of person you cant keep friends(in game) to keep a company sized and your land control is limited until you start to act right.

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57 minutes ago, Realist said:

Even though an Atlantis style area and base setting would be good(I do agree), believe me the “pirates” are going to be so pissed off lol.

they tried the whole tek tier underwater set up and ruined it. Personally I was pretty disappointed in that since I liked water tames a lot. Gave more of a challenge.

i really hope they don’t try to implement underwater bases(even though I like them) because they will not execute it well. Since they don’t have tek(hope to fing god) in this game it would have to be some sort of magic, which of course hasn’t been introduced yet. So it would be a good long while before Atlantis would be around. 

Yes, one day I would like to see it but they would be complete idiots to try to implement it even in the next 6 months. 

I actually started a thread one time on the Ark steam forums to discuss why Ark water content wasn’t more popular. It got a lot of different responses, but a common theme I found surprising was the number of people who had real life water based fears that kept them from enjoying that part of the game. Obviously one would kind of expect that to be less the case here, but I’m gonna bet that a lot of folks are here for the pirates and sailing and not so much the subnautica Jacques Cousteau simulator. I don’t care either way, I’m just looking for a fun game and my long time gaming buddy likes sailing so here we are. She doesn’t like Ark, so she’s not familiar with the joys of a GrapeCard EA.

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3 minutes ago, WilliamGrayton said:

IMO more islands  = more space for the land grabbers / exploiters / greedy players who currently control it all now. Giving them more room to expand does not seem like a good answer.

OP's suggestion about limiting the size of a claim by the number of "Active" personnel they have is a very fair and logical approach to this problem.  Large companies could potentially still control a large chunk of land but they would either all have to remain active players or continually recruit new blood to keep up the land.

To expand upon that you could also count the number of tenants they have on the land towards the size of the claim, the more you got people wise the more space you will need. Giving them the incentive to treat their tenants more fairly and not charging extreme tax rates or changing the rules to evict/steal peoples stuff. Word gets out you are a lousy landlord and you wont have no tenants usually if you are that kind of person you cant keep friends(in game) to keep a company sized and your land control is limited until you start to act right.

Yes!!!

This. This. This. This. Way to take a great idea and run with it. So many benefits to this approach and solves a number of problems. It addresses the most core issue related to land, namely how to deal with land ownership and tenancy when land is finite but playbase is variable. 

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4 hours ago, morph489 said:

Does anyone know if the devs have any plans for claiming......at the moment the system is so bad its basically forcing me to play other games

For example I sail around for several hours,,,,,which in itself is boring as fuck because you find companies have not 10 flags, or 20 flags, or even 50....no no some have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, so load up a better game to play while atlas sails in background.....find some land that looks promising....land and find 2-3 companies that have claimed everything.....the mountains, the beachs, the forests and the islands......you cant build anything there, and have to wander around finding a place that they haven't been in for a while......once you find it you set down a claim flag which then tells you its going to be 3 hours to claim....you cant build anything and gathering anything helps your enemy though the taxation system.....So then you log off and play anouther game for 3 hours...…

I think the devs need to help new players coming to the game.....esp as other mmo have know caught on too rule number 1 for MMO "If people can shit on each other......they will shit on each other"

I think a better system would be dependable on player count in company and having tiers of claims.....so for example a personal claim would be very small barely 20-25 feet across......a company of 5 or more has 50 feet and a company with 20 has 100 feet and so on and so on. And obvsiouly each company has only 1 claim...….therefore meaning new players have places to setup and build them selves up and bigger companies can expand without claiming everything by recruitment


Hopefully there get it sorted.....at the moment going off atlas and back to other games 
 

If you go back and (re?)watch the livestream they quite clearly say that the whole claims system was swamped the first day the servers wet on-line because of the unexpected number of players, and that it has already been decided to completely re-design the system and re-code it from the ground up.

This may or may not result in new dry territory but at the very least I hope it includes a very limited number of claims per player, preferably at a skill point cost.

Edited by Hambo

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2 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

I actually started a thread one time on the Ark steam forums to discuss why Ark water content wasn’t more popular. It got a lot of different responses, but a common theme I found surprising was the number of people who had real life water based fears that kept them from enjoying that part of the game. Obviously one would kind of expect that to be less the case here, but I’m gonna bet that a lot of folks are here for the pirates and sailing and not so much the subnautica Jacques Cousteau simulator. I don’t care either way, I’m just looking for a fun game and my long time gaming buddy likes sailing so here we are. She doesn’t like Ark, so she’s not familiar with the joys of a GrapeCard EA.

Well tell her that is will either be very pleasantly surprised or very pissed off. Who knows, they might surprise us, and I am really hoping they do(yeah no shit), but most of the hope is gone man. Just seeing how things are unfolding, I don’t see much change.

as far as fear of water, or more so drowning, that is something people need to get over. Even with my extreme fear of heights, in my fire academy we had to climb to the top of a 75 foot extension ladder on a truck. Then lock our legs in and act like we were falling backwards.

people need to face their fears rather it is real life or in game. Fear is what is considered irrational. Once you face it, it’s over. The problem is facing it.

but in all reality, it took me a year to get big into water taming/breeding because of the challenge it had. I loved it. Not sure if you are familiar with the blue mushroom cave on the rag map but I built a supreme base there. Completely unraidable, well I thought unraidable until a meager got there 😂

no hard feelings even towards the mesher now. I spent way too much time on ark the past few years. I’ll get on to help some buddies grind every once in awhile just to help them but wildcard just did wat too much bs for my liking.

sure I will still buy atlas on console, but believe me, once I start playing, you will actually see the passion come out and it will be a lot worse then this. 

This is nothing but being calm right now. I will hold them to learning and I will hold them to their own experience 

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My activity in the past week went to only logging in daily once and thats it. See you guys late february I guess.

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24 minutes ago, WilliamGrayton said:

IMO more islands  = more space for the land grabbers / exploiters / greedy players who currently control it all now. Giving them more room to expand does not seem like a good answer.

OP's suggestion about limiting the size of a claim by the number of "Active" personnel they have is a very fair and logical approach to this problem.  Large companies could potentially still control a large chunk of land but they would either all have to remain active players or continually recruit new blood to keep up the land.

To expand upon that you could also count the number of tenants they have on the land towards the size of the claim, the more you got people wise the more space you will need. Giving them the incentive to treat their tenants more fairly and not charging extreme tax rates or changing the rules to evict/steal peoples stuff. Word gets out you are a lousy landlord and you wont have no tenants usually if you are that kind of person you cant keep friends(in game) to keep a company sized and your land control is limited until you start to act right.

 

17 minutes ago, boomervoncannon said:

Yes!!!

This. This. This. This. Way to take a great idea and run with it. So many benefits to this approach and solves a number of problems. It addresses the most core issue related to land, namely how to deal with land ownership and tenancy when land is finite but playbase is variable. 

Not trying to argue by the way, and not saying the idea isn’t bad because it isn’t, it’s just there will always be a way around the limitations.(lets keep it friendly just this once)

first we will go with my old argument. If you limit claims per company, the 500 person company will diverse and keep dividing, to maximize claim amount. Good example is small tribe servers on ark. They didn’t even have a limited claim but still broke up and then built close together.

the sad part is the “big group” mentality is actually the problem. Yes, I fully understand wanting to feel the sense of belonging and reaching goals and all that.

william(my name as well). I actually like your ideas, please don’t think I don’t. And I am not shutting you down or even disagreeing with you.

i just know the fan base. I have been in Megas, alphas, only 50 man, only 25 man, 6 man, duos, and solo.

i really loved every aspect of ark to be honest, even though the devs were very seemingly incompetent. Great idea, bad execution. If you think atlas is different then there will be a disappointment coming.

mind you I didn’t say that atlas is the exact same as ark. I am telling you to get used to the “great idea, bad execution” because anyone that tells you different will be Mia leading you. 

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11 minutes ago, Loni said:

My activity in the past week went to only logging in daily once and thats it. See you guys late february I guess.

Hey loni, yeah that was a typical thing with ark as well. Many because of Dino upkeep or decay timers, depending on pvp or pve. 

To be honest, nobody here is as passionate as I am. They might say they are but they are full of it. I spent over a year wasting my time calling out wildcard for bs. I was on ark twitter everyday. They recently finally did the kibble rework and are finally starting s plus. I told them congrats, it had been 2 years since I said anything good to them.

Now I see them doing the same thing to atlas. I will not stand by and let another possible favorite game be turned into shit because of their poor decision making. I won’t allow it.

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Re. big companies grabbing land -  Big companies are big because there are a lot of players in them.  Those players deserve land as much as anybody else, something good to remember.  But if you're a big company, you don't need as much land as a small company, really.  You can share taming pens, shipyards, crop fields, etc.  The whole point is working together.  There ought to be some sensible number of claims per person and per company that reflect how the game is played.  Maybe we need a second kind of claim -  a company claim, and maybe that should take into account the number of alliances as well, because that covers big companies splitting up.

What if a company claim provided common areas everyone could use, as well as a few other perks to make it worthwhile.  So if you have a company >10 with 2 alliances or fewer, you can have a small company claim, 20-30  and 2-5 alliances gets a medium company claim and >30  with over 5 gets the biggest one.

Someone would have to sit down and figure out how much land that really is...enough for each player to have a house and a small garden maybe, and the rest company area.  People in the same company shouldn't mind building closer together, unlike strangers.  Let's make them go dense and share some bigger areas and give them some goodies to do it.

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10 hours ago, boomervoncannon said:

I actually started a thread one time on the Ark steam forums to discuss why Ark water content wasn’t more popular. It got a lot of different responses, but a common theme I found surprising was the number of people who had real life water based fears that kept them from enjoying that part of the game. Obviously one would kind of expect that to be less the case here, but I’m gonna bet that a lot of folks are here for the pirates and sailing and not so much the subnautica Jacques Cousteau simulator. I don’t care either way, I’m just looking for a fun game and my long time gaming buddy likes sailing so here we are. She doesn’t like Ark, so she’s not familiar with the joys of a GrapeCard EA.

You don't want to be over water or in water in a game as buggy as Atlas. If your character falls through the floor (usually happens on a server restart, and each update includes a server restart), you end up in the water and then you drown. Not that much fun to log in and find your character died. So the workaround some use, is put all there stuff into a storage box and then log out. Some even take the extreme step of drowning themselves before they log out. 

The reason I don't do much of the water stuff is that in ARK, when you DC'd underwater, you'd almost always log back into a dead character. I haven't played ARK for over a year, so maybe they fixed this. Back then, there was no body marker, it was pretty much impossible to find your body and get your stuff back. Might be better in Atlas, but kind of doubt it.

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I have heard rumor that they are currently looking at a redesign of the claim system, I suspect when that gets implemented we will see a server wipe to remove legacy flags that do not comply with the new format. In fact, that is part of the problem now. I have a good 1/10 of island that can be claimed, but I can't claim it because their neighbors have overlapped and no matter where in their claim they are, it renders ALL flags as contested...thats the old system when you COULD put flags in your claim and thus overlap them. The new system won't let you do it, it will tell you that you are too close to your own flag, just as the new format won't let you overlap into other's claims anymore either so we have a crap ton of land out there that can't be used because of two conflicting claim systems.

Honestly for any claim system to work there are a few stipulations that will need to be made and changes to ensure great use out of it.

A) Claim limit of 1/person - players have been screaming up and down about this some for and some against; however, in a game that has extremely limited land available and on servers where pvp isn't an option, you have to have a way to prevent artificial land grabbing.

B) Can not place claim flag inside your own claim area, this would prevent overlaps and currently is how it is implemented anyway.

C) Sleeping Dead - There should be counters to dealing with people who have quit the game but logged out in their claim. You can't take the claim because they are in it, we don't want to kill off claim sleepers either to protect offline. Sooo create a timer at the end of upkeep, once that timer has expired...say an hour, any sleeping bodies in the claim get killed and  forces a respawn to allow the claim to be contested.

D) Driveby Claim Interruptions - Seriously, this is probably the most frustrating part in taking a claim. Having it paused by thrid party players who are just casually passing through the claim to get from point A to B. The claim becomes contested and pauses, once they leave it resumes IF no one is in the claim for 30 seconds. If they enter at 5 seconds it pauses and resets the 30 second timer. This can cause a 4 hour claim process to turn into 12 hours just from people gathering and running by. Therefore I think it would make sense to also add a 30 second contest timer. If a third party player or anyone for that matter outside comp and alliance enters the claim, they have 30 seconds to leave the claim, failure to do so will contest and pause the capture. This makes sense as the owner isn't likely to just be running through. 30 seconds is plenty of time for them to get in and out. The capture time will run as normal until the 30 seconds has expired then it will pause. If a player triggers the timer, then leaves the claim at say 12 seconds. It resets the timer and stays that way until someone enters again restarting it. This will eliminate the majority of capture frustrations.

 

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20 hours ago, morph489 said:

Does anyone know if the devs have any plans for claiming......at the moment the system is so bad its basically forcing me to play other games

For example I sail around for several hours,,,,,which in itself is boring as fuck because you find companies have not 10 flags, or 20 flags, or even 50....no no some have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, so load up a better game to play while atlas sails in background.....find some land that looks promising....land and find 2-3 companies that have claimed everything.....the mountains, the beachs, the forests and the islands......you cant build anything there, and have to wander around finding a place that they haven't been in for a while......once you find it you set down a claim flag which then tells you its going to be 3 hours to claim....you cant build anything and gathering anything helps your enemy though the taxation system.....So then you log off and play anouther game for 3 hours...…

I think the devs need to help new players coming to the game.....esp as other mmo have know caught on too rule number 1 for MMO "If people can shit on each other......they will shit on each other"

I think a better system would be dependable on player count in company and having tiers of claims.....so for example a personal claim would be very small barely 20-25 feet across......a company of 5 or more has 50 feet and a company with 20 has 100 feet and so on and so on. And obvsiouly each company has only 1 claim...….therefore meaning new players have places to setup and build them selves up and bigger companies can expand without claiming everything by recruitment


Hopefully there get it sorted.....at the moment going off atlas and back to other games 
 

I have been saying the claim system is bad all along but the kool aid drinking lairs will tell you everything is fine... game all ready sunk its never seen green only red

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