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Stone Crafting Materials REALLY

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1 minute ago, Evir said:

what exactly is the point of building stone in PVE anyway? Just build a small stone fence around your base to keep animals away, it isnt like you actually have anything to fear, no one is going to attack you. You can literally just live in wood or thatch, as long as you have a 2 high stone wall around your base.

LMFAO because Alpha's don't exist? Because aggressive animals were just taken off the maps? Come on now. Walls looks ugly as heck and making a stone house instead of walling off what could be not only a treasure map spawn, but a good portion of resources, is just more aesthetic. I don't see the point of PVP, but you don't hear me questioning your life or play style, please don't do it to mine.

Just now, Luneder said:

sorry but pvpers are now at a stand still because if we attack a base then what? we can't build on that land unless we go tribal, and the sap islands are hedgehogs to attack.

Unless they buy from someone rich in those items. Then it becomes an economic climb of the mega's once again.

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1 minute ago, Nari said:

Say that to the alphas that will sprint back half way across an island to get the that wall it agrro'd to trying to eat your chickens.

Double stone wall, double gateway, done, I solved the problem for you. PVP players do not have this issue because we double wall everything, at a minimum anyone that does a single wall on PVP servers is a fool, unless it is completely unimportant.

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15 minutes ago, Evir said:

Well, the change will stop so many from building absurdly large bases and lagging out servers, that was the primary reason for the change, people act like they just want to screw over the player base, but this is 100% the reason why.

Large bases aren't the reason for the lag, it's not 100% certainty, but it's highly unlikely. Just as I can't say with 100% certainty people aren't abducted by aliens.

Basically, when there are pieces being rendered, your computer cares, to a server, that doesn't matter really. The server just tells your PC what is there. The server doesn't care what is there static wise (any not moving building piece). The server does care about moving parts. For instance, ships, tames, & NPCs; especially the scripts that control the latter 2. The server calculating what needs to happen is most likely the problem (what the animals need to do, what the NPCs need to do, what path your ship is going etc). 

The only possible problem is that there is a database overload, but that wouldn't cause high ping times or rubberbanding directly. It would however put stress on the servers CPU and create CPU cycle issues. Which would cause the server to slow down, which would affect your ping. Ping is an unimportant packet as far as servers are concerned. The only the reason the server would would be taking longer to respond is because it's saying "I'm busy gimme a second to get you a packet" due to CPU cycles and communicating with the database which to the server is more important than your request for the packet. 

So stop blaming it on peoples hard work and time spent gathering and building. You're spreading the plague of misinformation regarding how databases, servers, and clients legitimately work.

Edited by Vloshko
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2 minutes ago, Evir said:

Double stone wall, double gateway, done, I solved the problem for you. PVP players do not have this issue because we double wall everything, at a minimum anyone that does a single wall on PVP servers is a fool, unless it is completely unimportant.

I honeycomb in PvE because I can (but mostly due to fucked spawns). The problem isnt solved. It is now harder to build proper defenses in either realm. Regardless of what we do/dont need to fear.

Edited by Nari

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2 minutes ago, Jean Lafitte said:

Wrong.  Animals can destroy wood and they will chew on it for hours until they destroy the block or you kill them.  Furthermore, animals can spawn INSIDE buildings and walls.

Literally never had this happen. You guys must build very weird. Never lost an animal in any base I have built. 

Double wall, double gate, done and done, you can make a wood box, then stone foundations around it, then a 2 high stone wall around it, with a stone gate on the outside and a wood gate on the inside, you will have zero problems unless you let the animals in yourself.

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Just now, Evir said:

Double stone wall, double gateway, done, I solved the problem for you. PVP players do not have this issue because we double wall everything, at a minimum anyone that does a single wall on PVP servers is a fool, unless it is completely unimportant.

Yessss double stone wall with organic paste . . . looks at the trees and the wolves and the bears and the lions and the snakes and the cotton bushes. Sorry I don't see any nearby sap I can turn into organic paste for these double stone walls you speak of. Also you do realize just how much stone construction to circle my base would take compared to the buildings I already have there right or that alpha's and other aggressive animals can currently spawn INSIDE the base as in the house itself such as the alpha seagull and crow I had pottering around my dining room last night? Now they weren't aggressive so I could just open the window and wait but I've wolves spawn and happily let theselves be killed while trying to devour my water barrel.

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2 minutes ago, Vloshko said:

Large bases aren't the reason for the lag, it's not 100% certainty, but it's highly unlikely. Just as I can't say with 100% certainty people aren't abducted by aliens.

Basically, when there are pieces being rendered, your computer cares, to a server, that doesn't matter really. The server just tells your PC what is there. The server doesn't care what is there static wise (any not moving building piece). The server does care about moving parts. For instance, ships, tames, & NPCs; especially the scripts that control the latter 2. The server calculating what needs to happen is most likely the problem (what the animals need to do, what the NPCs need to do, what path your ship is going etc).  The only possible problem is that there is a database overload, but that wouldn't cause high ping times or rubberbanding. It would however put stress on the servers CPU and CPU cycle issues. Which would cause the server to slow down, which would affect your ping. Ping is an unimportant packet as far as servers are concerned. The only the reason the server would would be taking longer to respond is because it's saying "I'm busy gimme a second to get you a packet" due to CPU cycles. 

So stop blaming it on peoples hard work and time spent gathering and building. You're spreading the plague of misinformation regarding how databases, servers, and clients legitimately work. 

Thank you

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100% the stupidest thing Grapeshot has ever done. You guys are idiots. There was nothing wrong with them and now you done gone and screwed them all up.

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6 minutes ago, Evir said:

what exactly is the point of building stone in PVE anyway?

Longer item life span,less repairs to keep up,better durability,better protection from wildlife attacks,to name a few,it also looks nice.

2 minutes ago, Evir said:

Literally never had this happen. You guys must build very weird. Never lost an animal in any base I have built. 

Your either very lucky or playing a different game  😂

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4 minutes ago, Vloshko said:

Large bases aren't the reason for the lag, it's not 100% certainty, but it's highly unlikely. Just as I can't say with 100% certainty people aren't abducted by aliens.

Basically, when there are pieces being rendered, your computer cares, to a server, that doesn't matter really. The server just tells your PC what is there. The server doesn't care what is there static wise (any not moving building piece). The server does care about moving parts. For instance, ships, tames, & NPCs; especially the scripts that control the latter 2. The server calculating what needs to happen is most likely the problem (what the animals need to do, what the NPCs need to do, what path your ship is going etc). 

The only possible problem is that there is a database overload, but that wouldn't cause high ping times or rubberbanding directly. It would however put stress on the servers CPU and create CPU cycle issues. Which would cause the server to slow down, which would affect your ping. Ping is an unimportant packet as far as servers are concerned. The only the reason the server would would be taking longer to respond is because it's saying "I'm busy gimme a second to get you a packet" due to CPU cycles and communicating with the database which to the server is more important than your request for the packet. 

So stop blaming it on peoples hard work and time spent gathering and building. You're spreading the plague of misinformation regarding how databases, servers, and clients legitimately work.

I tried explaining this to people who think that the buildings are lagging the server, but they don't seem to understand.

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1 minute ago, Evir said:

Literally never had this happen. You guys must build very weird. Never lost an animal in any base I have built. 

Double wall, double gate, done and done, you can make a wood box, then stone foundations around it, then a 2 high stone wall around it, with a stone gate on the outside and a wood gate on the inside, you will have zero problems unless you let the animals in yourself.

Well, your stone wall just became a problem for those in the tundra didn't it? 0 sap.

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4 minutes ago, Vloshko said:

Large bases aren't the reason for the lag, it's not 100% certainty, but it's highly unlikely. Just as I can't say with 100% certainty people aren't abducted by aliens.

Basically, when there are pieces being rendered, your computer cares, to a server, that doesn't matter really. The server just tells your PC what is there. The server doesn't care what is there static wise (any not moving building piece). The server does care about moving parts. For instance, ships, tames, & NPCs; especially the scripts that control the latter 2. The server calculating what needs to happen is most likely the problem (what the animals need to do, what the NPCs need to do, what path your ship is going etc). 

The only possible problem is that there is a database overload, but that wouldn't cause high ping times or rubberbanding directly. It would however put stress on the servers CPU and create CPU cycle issues. Which would cause the server to slow down, which would affect your ping. Ping is an unimportant packet as far as servers are concerned. The only the reason the server would would be taking longer to respond is because it's saying "I'm busy gimme a second to get you a packet" due to CPU cycles and communicating with the database which to the server is more important than your request for the packet. 

So stop blaming it on peoples hard work and time spent gathering and building. You're spreading the plague of misinformation regarding how databases, servers, and clients legitimately work.

Please explain how, low population servers with very little built up on them, run fine, but low population servers right next to them with less people on them, and tons of stuff built, run like a slide show, the ping is through the roof on some of these 20 player servers, and they have massive bases, but a 20 player server that is basically barren runs fine.

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5 minutes ago, Evir said:

Literally never had this happen. You guys must build very weird. Never lost an animal in any base I have built. 

Double wall, double gate, done and done, you can make a wood box, then stone foundations around it, then a 2 high stone wall around it, with a stone gate on the outside and a wood gate on the inside, you will have zero problems unless you let the animals in yourself.

I have a base made up of just squares, nothing fancy. It was walled, no windows, roofed 10x5 tiles. I logged in one-day to find my 2 wolves and sheep had all been killed by a snake while inside the centre of this base.

 

Just because it doesn't happen to you doesn't mean it hasn't happened to others. Its a very well reported bug. I've even logged in to find a sheep IN the foundation fully stuck.

Edited by Bradley1928
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FK this change ! Organic paste really ???!!!!

How the hell do i get them in Tundra .

There is no joy in GRINDING MORE MATERIALS .

I could live with the change to large gate but now it is impossible to build a secure house against wild animal less alone alpha . The cost now way too high to build a good looking base !

WE DON'T NEED THIS CHANGE !

WHOEVER APPROVED THIS CHANGE IS A HUGE SADIST !

Edited by kampfer91
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I had my entire base set up like a gosh darn ugly cubed box to keep stuff safe, and a croc spawned inside it. I watched it fall from my ceiling, on to the ground and wreck my tames. I've come home and opened my door to Wolves and Crocs inside my house (no matter how big or small) It's not about anything running up, honeycombing looks gross to me. it's about the spawn locations set on the map being still inside foundationed areas.

Lucky you that it's never happened, but it's happened to enough people all over that Jat and the team are trying to figure out WHY it keeps ahppening.

Edited by Asanna

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5 minutes ago, Jean Lafitte said:

Well, your stone wall just became a problem for those in the tundra didn't it? 0 sap.

Exactly I live in the Tundra and stone used to be easy for me wood, thatch, fibre, stone, craft, build. Now I need to dodge SotD while travelling to a different zone in order to get sap, dodge more SotD going home and then turn it into organic paste to build in stone. The risk/reward has just  massively swung to the risk side since I was already doing as few trips as possible because I don't like dodging half a dozen red ships of the damned in my schooner to get to a neighbouring isle for metal now I've got to do that over multiple servers for sap if I want to build in stone on an island that's got huge amounts of stone all around me?

Edited by Senkoau

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5 minutes ago, Pindrought said:

I tried explaining this to people who think that the buildings are lagging the server, but they don't seem to understand.

I had sap in the tundra when we lived there, I went and got it, hop on your ship, and go get it like everyone else. Trade for it, do something, we have zero salt on our server currently, and cobalt is our metal, we have to go get the salt, just to make alloy. Go get it.

Edited by Evir

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Damn i have to get out of lurking now...

This patch... it is horrible.
There is so much that needs to be reverted. There is no damn reason that a Stonewall should cost that much! I mean i knew what i was getting into when starting Atlas. I devoted alot of my freetime to this game and had loads of fun eventhough we got wiped yesterday. But this is insane... 
This patch does screw over not only small companies or solo players but the middle companies aswell. Especialy those who are settled in colder regions or try to because they got zerged by a big company(us right now).

There was nothing wrong with stonewalls. Not the slightest bit. Not the requiered materials and not the damage they took.

I really hope this is just a hickup because someone didn't get enough sleep.
Please really... revert this. Make an emergency patch today! Make sure to inform us about it beforehand, so we can be prepared and know that you care.

If you have done that you should get a good meal and a good amount if sleep.
Sorry but really this really looks like somones brain bugged out. So... some food and some sleep might fix it.


And to those who think this will prevent people from building absurdly large bases NO! They will build them even larger with 10-20 layers of wood, if the pace allows it! So there will be MORE structures instead of less!

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This is ridiculous. I thought it couldn't get any worse after the all-court effort to make sailing a drag (fog + cyclonse + SoTD).  But they pinpointed an equivalent for base building.

Organic paste is the rarest commodity on the Tundra, and you need it to live. Putting it in stone recipes is a kick in the nards on the order of the FoY.

Why are you making the game such a hassle? It's supposed to be fun.

Edited by Ringo O'Rourke
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I too do not understand a patch that both massively reduces the raid durability of stone structures whilst simultaneously also making them 3-4 times more difficult to craft.

If you lack access to a particular resource you are doubly screwed by this, I have friends in cold regions who already lack any source of sap near them, which they already need in large quantities just for staying alive and providing themselves with fur armour. Adding metal to the mix seems to be particularly salting the wound.

Any patch that makes offline raiding more of a thing is not a good move either in my opinion, if anything stone structures should have had their durability increased with this material change.

If they wanted to achieve something like this they should have added a new structure type “Fortified Stone/Castle wall” and then nerfed the durability of regular stone to assault (and not to where it is now, slightly above wood apparently”) and given this new structure these material costs and moved stone up the construction tree and maybe increased skill point cost to get to the end of the construction tree. Make the sections large and only suitable for building outer walls (say 2 x 2 of the current wall size), presumably this would help with server strain as it would be less individual objects to track and load. It was already not all that hard to mount a cannon on a cargo saddle and bust through stone so I am left to ask “Erm.... why?”

I also think the damage change should have been more to the catapult, a generally not very useful/used weapon where it's new function would be for taking out land based structures as I believe (correct me if I am wrong) it is pretty poor otherwise. A ship kitted out with a few catapults is not going to be great at sea combat, but would be a specific vessel used for besieging bases.

I consider this change very ill advised and not tremendously well thought out at the moment.

Edited by Not Happy
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I was chocked this morning when I continued to cleanup our habour area. 10 paste and 17 metals returned for a demo, it was a WTF moment of epic proportions.

If players build too much simply impose a structure limit. And before you say that wont work, we already have it for ships and tames so...

And why does a foundation have 5000 HP while a wall got 10000 HP?

Edited by Shintai
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4 minutes ago, Not Happy said:

I too do not understand a patch that both massively reduces the raid durability of stone structures whilst simultaneously also making them 3-4 times more difficult to craft.

If you lack access to a particular resource you are doubly screwed by this, I have friends in cold regions who already lack any source of sap near them, which they already need in large quantities just for staying alive and providing themselves with fur armour. Adding metal to the mix seems to be particularly salting the wound.

Any patch that makes offline raiding more of a thing is not a good move either in my opinion, if anything stone structures should have had their durability increased with this material change.

If they wanted to achieve something like this they should have added a new structure type “Fortified Stone/Castle wall” and then nerfed the durability of regular stone to assault (and not to where it is now, slightly above wood apparently”) and given this new structure these material costs and moved stone up the construction tree and maybe increased skill point cost to get to the end of the construction tree. Make the sections large and only suitable for building outer walls. It was already not all that hard to mount a cannon on a cargo saddle and bust through stone so I am left to ask “Erm.... why?”

I also think the damage change should have been more to the catapult, a generally not very useful/used weapon where it's new function would be for taking out land based structures as I believe (correct me if I am wrong) it is pretty poor otherwise. A ship kitted out with a few catapults is not going to be great at sea combat, but would be a specific vessel used for besieging bases.

I consider this change very ill advised and not tremendously well thought out at the moment.

I would rather not end up like Dark and Light where every PVPer quit because bases were literally unraidable and you could literally spend hours banging on a single door just to find another right behind it, after the PVPers quit the game basically died except for a few private servers. 

Edited by Evir

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4 minutes ago, Not Happy said:

I consider this change very ill advised and not tremendously well thought out at the moment.

Well, isn't that just becoming par for the course?

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