McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 I dont know if its just me, but i absolutely hate the gun reload mechanic. Even if you play that stupid mini game to perfection, it takes you out of he fight for like 6-8 seconds. That, in my opinion, is shit game play,. I'd like to suggest lowering the reload time of guns by about 90% and deleting that stupid mini game. Ofc the damage would need to be nerfed to adjust for the increased rate of fire. And bullet craft rate would also need to be increased i think. I mean honestly.. who thought a mechanic that left players unable to act(other than running in circles) for 8-15 seconds was a good idea. That is shit game design and boring gameplay. Succeeding or failing, the gun fight feels clunky, slow, and boring. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coggage 239 Posted January 13, 2019 About what it would actually have been like to use flintlocks. One shot, then you have a nice club in your hand. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sulfurblade 194 Posted January 13, 2019 2 hours ago, McGimp said: I dont know if its just me, but i absolutely hate the gun reload mechanic. Even if you play that stupid mini game to perfection, it takes you out of he fight for like 6-8 seconds. That, in my opinion, is shit game play,. I'd like to suggest lowering the reload time of guns by about 90% and deleting that stupid mini game. Ofc the damage would need to be nerfed to adjust for the increased rate of fire. And bullet craft rate would also need to be increased i think. I mean honestly.. who thought a mechanic that left players unable to act(other than running in circles) for 8-15 seconds was a good idea. That is shit game design and boring gameplay. Succeeding or failing, the gun fight feels clunky, slow, and boring. Your absolutely right! The Fact you can somehow reload a flint lock in 8 seconds is horse crap!!! It should obviously take more like 20 seconds... 1 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 Im fine with that i guess... if they nerf predators into the ground. Or buff melee to be viable. Or add a reliable healing item into the game to deal with losing 75% hp after every creature kill. 2 minutes ago, Sulfurblade said: Your absolutely right! The Fact you can somehow reload a flint lock in 8 seconds is horse crap!!! It should obviously take more like 20 seconds... The fact that eating too much meat or not enough fish kills me is totally spot on realism too. Oh, and the ghost ships, super realistic. Oh, and the fact that i dont have to physically grab every cannon ball from storage every reload. Yes.. this game is super realistic. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sulfurblade 194 Posted January 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, McGimp said: Im fine with that i guess... if they nerf predators into the ground. Or buff melee to be viable. Or add a reliable healing item into the game to deal with losing 75% hp after every creature kill. The fact that eating too much meat or not enough fish kills me is totally spot on realism too. Oh, and the ghost ships, super realistic. Oh, and the fact that i dont have to physically grab every cannon ball from storage every reload. Yes.. this game is super realistic. Feel free to complain about the vitamin system cause your right its not realistic and should be changed! Your also right the AI crew should walk back and forth from the ammo box, but "these developers would much that up" so careful what you wish for! However as for ghost ships its obviously a trick of the mind, you been sailing too much.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightstrasza 137 Posted January 13, 2019 Just give guns back the damage, the reload speed is fine, this is not first person shooter. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rowdy 2 Posted January 13, 2019 I kind of agree, but I also disagree. I agree that gunfights can be quite boring during reload time, but it only makes the reload skill better and a good return of investment. I also don't think pvp should be a gunfight only, as melee was a huge part of the combat back then. Your problem is really not playing the fight as they are designed, as you are effectively only fighting with gun(s), thus neglecting melee weapons, grenades, throwing knives and other alternatives/secondary weaponry. Shooting your guns and then go melee was the way they fought. Often they had 4-6 loaded guns as they had no time to reload in a fight. If you can't finish off an opponent with 4-6 shots available including a carbine shot, fault is on you really. By lowering the reload time of guns, you indirectly nerf melee, as it will no longer be remotely useful as the window of opportunity is so small (reduced enemy movement speed and threat of a loaded gun) that it's gonna be even harder to fight ranged as melee. What do needs rebalance however, is flame arrows. Naked lowcost bow with a few flame arrows as the META is just absurd. You could easily stock up on hundreds of bows and flame ammo and keep fighting. You don't even have to care about armor, as you just need to hit with 1-2 flame arrows on a fully geared enemy. Try getting pushed by 2-3 naked flame arrow guys, then you will hate reloading even more. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightstrasza 137 Posted January 13, 2019 40 minutes ago, rowdy said: I kind of agree, but I also disagree. I agree that gunfights can be quite boring during reload time, but it only makes the reload skill better and a good return of investment. I also don't think pvp should be a gunfight only, as melee was a huge part of the combat back then. Your problem is really not playing the fight as they are designed, as you are effectively only fighting with gun(s), thus neglecting melee weapons, grenades, throwing knives and other alternatives/secondary weaponry. Shooting your guns and then go melee was the way they fought. Often they had 4-6 loaded guns as they had no time to reload in a fight. If you can't finish off an opponent with 4-6 shots available including a carbine shot, fault is on you really. By lowering the reload time of guns, you indirectly nerf melee, as it will no longer be remotely useful as the window of opportunity is so small (reduced enemy movement speed and threat of a loaded gun) that it's gonna be even harder to fight ranged as melee. What do needs rebalance however, is flame arrows. Naked lowcost bow with a few flame arrows as the META is just absurd. You could easily stock up on hundreds of bows and flame ammo and keep fighting. You don't even have to care about armor, as you just need to hit with 1-2 flame arrows on a fully geared enemy. Try getting pushed by 2-3 naked flame arrow guys, then you will hate reloading even more. How about if players wettness was higher than 75% (or something like that), they would be immune to fire damage. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rowdy 2 Posted January 13, 2019 6 minutes ago, Nightstrasza said: How about if players wettness was higher than 75% (or something like that), they would be immune to fire damage. That would certainly be a welcomed change, but I think you need a bit more than that, as there are some quite big islands with no access to water. But I like the tactical aspect of staying near water for protection. In my eyes I think flame arrows should be more of a early game siege option before explosives, which is better than a hatchet/pickaxe, but I don't mind the burning effect, as long a you hit the target directly. But you should hit at least 3-4 arrows. However, It would be awesome if you could hit players with oil jars, so they get a wet effect status, just instead of water, it should be oil of course, and if you hit an oil soaked enemy with fire, he would only require one arrow. Right now, flame arrows are better than sabres in melee, as they deal more damage, are easier to land (in melee'ish range) and they do not sort of stun you after your attack. You don't even have to land the arrow, as long as you land your shot next to them or in front. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightstrasza 137 Posted January 13, 2019 1 minute ago, rowdy said: That would certainly be a welcomed change, but I think you need a bit more than that, as there are some quite big islands with no access to water. But I like the tactical aspect of staying near water for protection. In my eyes I think flame arrows should be more of a early game siege option before explosives, which is better than a hatchet/pickaxe, but I don't mind the burning effect, as long a you hit the target directly. But you should hit at least 3-4 arrows. However, It would be awesome if you could hit players with oil jars, so they get a wet effect status, just instead of water, it should be oil of course, and if you hit an oil soaked enemy with fire, he would only require one arrow. Right now, flame arrows are better than sabres in melee, as they deal more damage, are easier to land (in melee'ish range) and they do not sort of stun you after your attack. You don't even have to land the arrow, as long as you land your shot next to them or in front. Well, the wettness threshold could be lower aswell ppl could carry with them buckets of water to splash other ppl. Or maybe throwing water jars like grenades. However yes, there's definitely a big lack of inland water sources, especialy drinkable water. Changing islands however would require a wipe... and those islands would have to be good to not cause major anger for unjustified wipe. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rowdy 2 Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Nightstrasza said: Well, the wettness threshold could be lower aswell ppl could carry with them buckets of water to splash other ppl. Or maybe throwing water jars like grenades. However yes, there's definitely a big lack of inland water sources, especialy drinkable water. Changing islands however would require a wipe... and those islands would have to be good to not cause major anger for unjustified wipe. There is definitely a good amount of options for mechanics, but I think it's gonna be a bit annoying to have to deal with any mechanic, as long as it remains that easy to apply the burn effect. Having to remember to keep wetness up, by either taking a dip or shower yourself, because you expect people to bring flame arrows is just dumb if you ask me. A solution should either be a relatively simple reactionary defense mechanic and not preemptively, or a more complicated offensive mechanic based on high risk, high reward.. Flame arrows should never be a better option than sabres and guns. It should be an option because you don't have anything better to fight with. Edited January 13, 2019 by rowdy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ransurias 36 Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) Reload speed isn't a problem. They're flintlock weapons. However, they desperately need to do more damage. At the very least, giving every creature a headshot hitbox would significantly improve things. It makes no sense that giraffes, bears, crocodiles, rhinos, elephants, and boars have no headshot hitbox, and it really emphasizes just how insignificant 75 damage is (which is the new base damage of the flintlock pistol). Two flintlock pistol bullets isn't enough to bring down many creatures in this game, which is fairly retarded given how insanely long it takes to reload them (not to mention how many skillpoints firearms cost). They're not completely useless due to their long-range / hitscan potential, but they're still extremely underwhelming right now. Edited January 13, 2019 by Ransurias 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coggage 239 Posted January 13, 2019 Always carry a bow, and always carry as many pistols as you can. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightstrasza 137 Posted January 13, 2019 4 hours ago, Coggage said: Always carry a bow, and always carry as many pistols as you can. Pistols suck, blunderbuss suck, only carbine can one-tap a low lvl predator in the head and takes ages to reload. Just use good quality bow with perks, only bows, pistols are good for killing low lvl birds (15-20 lvl and higher survive 1 shoot) or killing sharks/manta rays that won't get off after agroing from the shore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 4 hours ago, Ransurias said: Reload speed isn't a problem. They're flintlock weapons. However, they desperately need to do more damage. At the very least, giving every creature a headshot hitbox would significantly improve things. It makes no sense that giraffes, bears, crocodiles, rhinos, elephants, and boars have no headshot hitbox, and it really emphasizes just how insignificant 75 damage is (which is the new base damage of the flintlock pistol). Two flintlock pistol bullets isn't enough to bring down many creatures in this game, which is fairly retarded given how insanely long it takes to reload them (not to mention how many skillpoints firearms cost). They're not completely useless due to their long-range / hitscan potential, but they're still extremely underwhelming right now. I disagree, i think reload speed IS a problem. Flintlock or not, this is a fantasy game in every aspect except those that would make the game more enjoyable. If its punishing theyll put it in the game if it make for more fluid gameplay.. nope. Faster reload speed rather than higher damage would accomplish the same thing, while also smoothing combat out a bit. Not everything has to be 100% realistic, in fact did they try that they would end up with some pretty busted gameplay - looking at you vitamin system. Looking at you 0% speed against the wind. Looking at you... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Goldfish The Builder 105 Posted January 13, 2019 It takes ages to reload real flintlock guns, time to reload is just fine! Insta reload would kill off bows and melee 100% and wouldnt fit with the games style 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Goldfish The Builder said: It takes ages to reload real flintlock guns, time to reload is just fine! Insta reload would kill off bows and melee 100% and wouldnt fit with the games style Simple fix, damage fall off for guns. Meaning at long range bows will be more powerful than guns. And melee arguably doesn't currently have a place in this game given the trash can physics and ai. And again, not everything should be a mirror of reality, its a game and some realism has to be sacrificed in the pursuit of a fluid and enjoyable gaming experience. Edited January 13, 2019 by McGimp Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coggage 239 Posted January 13, 2019 I think the reloading minigame should go, because the time is better spent running. Who has time to stand still when mobs are after you? I'd bother with it if, instead of being speedier, the more accurately you played the minigame the more damage resulted. I mean, a perfectly-loaded shot - the right powder charge, the ball wadded in snugly and everything tamped down to the perfect degree - should do more than a hastily loaded shot. Well, I think so, probably others don't. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Graylance Ravenwind 8 Posted January 13, 2019 My personal issue with current guns is not the mini-game, but their effectiveness vs. their cost in all respects (Skill Points, Crafting/Repair Cost, Bullet Costs). I posted my observations in this post just after v10 hit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
archaegeo 192 Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) Reload speed is 100% good. Has nothing to do with reload speed. Has all to do with damage. A flintlock on a level 10 pig should be 1 shot kill. They nerfed the damage way too much. But thats why it was 1 shot, and then swap to the sword on your side Noone does that, they do 1 shot, then run around bitching about how long its taking to reload. Edited January 13, 2019 by archaegeo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, archaegeo said: Reload speed is 100% good. Has nothing to do with reload speed. Has all to do with damage. A flintlock on a level 10 pig should be 1 shot kill. They nerfed the damage way too much. But thats why it was 1 shot, and then swap to the sword on your side Noone does that, they do 1 shot, then run around bitching about how long its taking to reload. Because the melee combat is garbage. Add to that the lack of healing in the game. Add to that the over spawning preds. You cant afford to take a melee fight in this game. Even taking one hit from an animal could mean death, if not to the hit then to the subsequent alpha spawn that jumps on you. I guess i was wrong though. Some people seem to like the 10 second reload timer... My mind is blown. you spend more time reloading than playing the game lol. Thirty shots and you have spent 5 minutes of your game time waiting on reloads and thats IF you hit the minigame 100% if not it can be as much as ~10 minutes. Nutty... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coggage 239 Posted January 13, 2019 12 minutes ago, archaegeo said: But thats why it was 1 shot, and then swap to the sword on your side Noone does that, they do 1 shot, then run around bitching about how long its taking to reload. If only Melee wasn't so utterly useless though. Every opinion expressed about Melee in the forums says, without exception, that it's a waste of points. So is the Armour, too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IsilithTehroth 23 Posted January 13, 2019 Gun play is perfect the way it is. We could do with better and more unique mini games though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McGimp 56 Posted January 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, IsilithTehroth said: Gun play is perfect the way it is. We could do with better and more unique mini games though. Stop... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IsilithTehroth 23 Posted January 13, 2019 1 minute ago, McGimp said: Stop... This game is not meant to be Call of Duty where you spam bullets. Its tactical where you need to make your shots count. So kindly gfys Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
