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ElBeavis

Dietary Balance (or Lack Thereof)

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With the new farming system, there's less incentive to go out and swing one's pickax.  This greatly contributed to maintaining a balanced diet, as it tired your character out quickly and helped drain the various vitamins (so you could fill them up in a reasonable manner).  Swimming and dancing also contribute, but not as significantly as swinging an ax. 

Additionally, many people bypass this mechanic by committing suicide (like eating feces or rotten meat).  Some in PVE point weapons at each other, as well.  This contradicts the game's survival intent and is crosses into moral dilemma territory... not something we really want younger players of the game to experience or think is okay.  Moralities and issues of suicide aside, is this something game developers are willing to take on? 

Possible solutions include allowing building (ships or bases), dancing, swimming, and fishing for flotsam to contribute more to vitamin drain so players can maintain a diet without resorting to more unsavory tactics....

Thanks!

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Yep have noticed I am more lethargic and hard to keep vitamins level without working out with the axe.   I suppose one could run in front of the bear cargo train instead of riding....but then that means taking the first hit rather than your bear tanking it for you.

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I recently found the way. I just feel cold (sometimes tn farmer biomes I have to wait until it's night and take off my clothes). Then I enter battle mode (with no weapon just knuckles) and star to rapidly push: left-left, right-right, left-left, right-right...

My pathfinder start those fast dodge charges and it's greatly reduce stamina and with "cold state" it strongly affect stomach level. So I do this to low my stamina, then wait till it's up, and repeat it for about 5-6 times. Then I hungry and go for vits. As I mentioned before it's 1 piece of cooked fish and meat and 5 pieces of berries and vegis.

I usually eat 5-5-25-25 (or 6-6-30-30). So... again. It's no survival. If you find a way - it's going to routine state.

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Refilling stamina/health and cold drains Foodlevel.
To help with vitamins, when not using much Food, you can do several things.
Just eat and drain life (refilling life also drains food)
Use Stamina (healing or dmg buff for tames works good).
Skill the vit depletion stuff.
If you eat basic stuff, eat meat first, then wait for it to have it refill you foodlevel, then when above 100 (or near) eat the veggies and berries. Use milk for vit D.

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If you use the shovel to dig for a while it will begin to empty your stomach meter quite fast.

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What is this food you speak of?

Poop is wonderful! It restores my vitamins, fills my food bar and fills my water too. Its the best thing!

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A combination of pork pie and pudding will restore vitamin equilibrium.  Make those and invest in overeating tolerance will help immensely.

Assuming you don't want to eat poop or lead.

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1 hour ago, Gindorf said:

What is this food you speak of?

Poop is wonderful! It restores my vitamins, fills my food bar and fills my water too. Its the best thing!

It's pretty bad for your equilibrium though.

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On 8/4/2020 at 9:02 AM, ElBeavis said:

With the new farming system, there's less incentive to go out and swing one's pickax.  This greatly contributed to maintaining a balanced diet, as it tired your character out quickly and helped drain the various vitamins (so you could fill them up in a reasonable manner).  Swimming and dancing also contribute, but not as significantly as swinging an ax. 

Additionally, many people bypass this mechanic by committing suicide (like eating feces or rotten meat).  Some in PVE point weapons at each other, as well.  This contradicts the game's survival intent and is crosses into moral dilemma territory... not something we really want younger players of the game to experience or think is okay.  Moralities and issues of suicide aside, is this something game developers are willing to take on? 

Possible solutions include allowing building (ships or bases), dancing, swimming, and fishing for flotsam to contribute more to vitamin drain so players can maintain a diet without resorting to more unsavory tactics....

Thanks!

Maybe it was like a garbage mechanic to begin with. It's been nothing but a thorn since day 1, just like eating a handful of berries will give you... Toxic vitamin C poisoning and kill you? Another shit mechanic, nope see if you eat too much vitamin C, ur piss is just gonna be yellow and you might get the runs. But not in ATLAS, that shit will fucking murder you dead, 10/10 game mechanic. Players will always game the system. What incentive is there to maintain a diet? There isnt any, so why not kill yourself and respawn? There isnt any penalty for that, 100% easier than maintaining a stupid diet.

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Whats ironic is that whenever players ask the devs to get rid of the vits, we get loadsa backlash from players who say it's a necessary part of the game. Only to find out that they are the ones who let themselves die and don't even bother with the vits bar. When you have a mechanic that bad and the devs still don't change it I have to wonder if they play their own game for more than 10 mins at a time.

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The idea of the system is not bad, after all getting scurvy was a real concern for pirates.   Just like running out of cannonballs or not having backup picks for getting emergency supplies , you have to be prepared.   But killing you because you ate too many berries or you did not shovel needlessly that day is dumb, as is rewarding you for eating poop with a vitamin balanced body.  There should be a very long time constant on the diet balance, IRL scurvy takes six weeks to set in and months to kill off your crew.   Since each game day is an hour making that time constant a real life day would represent weeks in game and be more realistic.   And like the real life disease it should just fatigue you as the warning that you need to eat some berries.   And the daily balanced diet for 5 fish filets, 5 steaks, and 25 handfuls of berries and 25 servings of veggies needs to be divided by 5 to be realistic.      So do both of those things reducing the dietary intake and increasing the diet time constant then the only game impact it will have is if you get caught unprepared, otherwise like keeping your pick sharp it becomes a minimal maintenance that is not even remotely a chore.     

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Well for scurvy you only need to eat limes, that's where the term limey's comes from. But seriously even with survival being key, nobody eats that often in real life, in fact you can actually go weeks with no food. its water you can't do without for long. So yeh I agree it could and should be more realistic. But with the accelerated ageing too, then I guess realism isn't a first priority anyway.

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Well technically then vitamin drain and food drain are the same thing if realistically it takes weeks, but of course you should gradually get more and more fatigue setting in.    Can not be very active when you are on a hunger strike.     In single player I think you could adjust for this realism, but I never bothered because it is so damn easy to get food stacks, even fish they made it so the pole/net gets more fish filets then the spear/pike/speargun does.    After that you learn your 25/5 pattern put the stacks in the hotbar and mash some keys to stay in balance.   You do not even need to learn cooking to stay in balance, the biggest issue is the overeating is required to stay in balance which is nonsense even if you are that inactive.

 

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You could just do what we do, overeat to boost your vit bars, then stam out once or twice to get rid of the overeating de-buff. The vitamin system really isn't that much of an issue, plus if you do keep them balanced you double your fortification. Effort/reward. Oh and ps. You have heard of dysentery haven't you? That's basically supercharged vitamin c poisoning I believe! (I could be wrong though so don't quote me)

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9 hours ago, MunchATG said:

You could just do what we do, overeat to boost your vit bars, then stam out once or twice to get rid of the overeating de-buff. The vitamin system really isn't that much of an issue, plus if you do keep them balanced you double your fortification. Effort/reward. Oh and ps. You have heard of dysentery haven't you? That's basically supercharged vitamin c poisoning I believe! (I could be wrong though so don't quote me)

Will maybe you should read a wiki before posting wrong information.   Yes severe dietary vitamin overdose can give you the squirts, but dysentery does not come from vitamin overdose it is a gut infection.     The point we are making is that oveating a handful of berries is not going to kill you IRL, the game needs to learn what the difference is between a diet and a meal by using much longer time constants for diet.  The only result from not eating for weeks, or eating only berries for weeks should be fatigue sets in (and yes fatigue is an indirect cause of death).

The point is not is the existing mechanic easy to deal with, it is that it is a bunch of unrealistic nonsense that could much be much better implemented.   It should not be an unfun hourly minigame.  Increase the balanced diet and hunger time constants to be weeks, reduce the daily required food intake by five.  Fatigue you when hungry or unbalanced diet.    That reduces the impact to only being you set sail across the map doing nothing but eating the berries from the pig trough for an IRL day (game weeks)  is going to leave you unprepared and too fatigued to fight on.

Edited by krazmuze

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Well I did say I could be wrong. My bad. I also did say dont quote me! However it would appear most people are forgetting one important factor, its a game! The devs are just trying to give the game a unique mechanic that makes you pay attention to your character and to give the game a little more depth. And, it really isn't a major drag to deal with anyway.

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If people in the game find it easier to let their character die than to bother eating, then  it must be a major drag for some. Also it's less about character depth than being an easy way to keep people busy, and not have to add loadsa other game content to do, All grinding in survival and rpg games are just time fillers. I mean I love eso and its full of content, but some of the grinding now is insane.

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eso is not a survival game, it is MMO grinding intended to keep you playing it a long time doing mindless things because it in theory increases social connection (the longer you are on the more people you talk to ) and they also increase the grinding to promote the pay for convenience items (crafting bag)

I think a pirate game wanting to give people scurvy when they are unprepared is certainly reasonable - it serves the same function as running out of cannonballs

It does not take long to collect food, between the fishing chair and the windmill and the bear it is not even remotely a chore anymore most food just gets dropped or rotted as there is too much of it.  It is the making it an hourly minigame of mashing keys 60 times that is straight up nonsense (unless you invest in cooking to get the combo meals).   That is why most people would rather get the death reward and bypass the system.   Could you imagine the complaints about pick repairs if every hour you would have to bang on it 50 times to fix it?   Nobody ever complains about it because you just put it in your smithy and hit E, not a big minigame and it just serves to catch you unprepared.   Even though that is also is unrealistic as a steel pick should last more than a few game hours

Edited by krazmuze

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Some people skill fortitude and eat properly balanced food.
Some only skill weight and eat shit.

Both is fine.
I like the buff way to much, also i dislike shit 🙂
If you want to keep your buff, you will find your way to eat accordingly.

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On 8/5/2020 at 6:58 PM, krazmuze said:

Well technically then vitamin drain and food drain are the same thing if realistically it takes weeks, but of course you should gradually get more and more fatigue setting in.    Can not be very active when you are on a hunger strike.     In single player I think you could adjust for this realism, but I never bothered because it is so damn easy to get food stacks, even fish they made it so the pole/net gets more fish filets then the spear/pike/speargun does.    After that you learn your 25/5 pattern put the stacks in the hotbar and mash some keys to stay in balance.   You do not even need to learn cooking to stay in balance, the biggest issue is the overeating is required to stay in balance which is nonsense even if you are that inactive.

 

There are Dragons and Hydras in the game 😄

 

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3 hours ago, Kummba said:

Some people skill fortitude and eat properly balanced food.
Some only skill weight and eat shit.

Both is fine.
I like the buff way to much, also i dislike shit 🙂
If you want to keep your buff, you will find your way to eat accordingly.

Hey now, I specd into stam too 😛

Mostly weight, but stam too...

Edited by Gindorf

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Eso is an rpg, mmo yeh, but still an rpg. As I mentioned. Also the grinding i'm talking about in Eso is for the materials not the bosses, so it is a solo objective not a group one. Just because atlas is a survival game doesn't mean I want to eat every 10 minutes of gameplay. Yeh if you take into account the accelerated ageing then you're probably only eating once a day or less in their messed up game time calculator. But in any case, it makes no difference what I think about it cos as I have pointed out players have been moaning about it since the start and the vits still haven't changed that much. Even though they gave us a farmhouse to gather resources, which people rarely complained about doing anyway. As for dysentry, well that is a stomach infection. Scurvy is a lack of vit c, which as I stated we could eat limes for. But as the games about as realistic  as a hollywood smile,  it makes no difference anyway.

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Pork pies, Fish N' Chips. It doesn't balance Vitamin C (bugged) but berries are found everywhere. "Overate!"? Who cares.

Low hunger but vitamins are fine? Eat spoiled meat. 5 damage, but fills 10 hunger. Carry around ~10 spoiled meat or kill something and carry the meat and it spoil in inventory. Now your hunger is never a problem.

Done. Everything else is trivial or superfluous, aside from the buffs from certain food and drink.

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3 hours ago, Xantria said:

Low hunger but vitamins are fine? Eat spoiled meat. 5 damage, but fills 10 hunger. Carry around ~10 spoiled meat or kill something and carry the meat and it spoil in inventory. Now your hunger is never a problem.

It is this sort of mechanical nonsense I am talking about....

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Usually have about 99% uptime on the vitamin buff. When you get down to 35 on each, regardless of what your hunger is, eat 3 meat, 3 fish(milk), 3 (or 15 wild) veggies, and 15 berries. If you are still hungry, go over 50 up to like 65. It moves from 65 down to 50 really quick.

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