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SusanT

Dev's when is retaliation appropriate against Griefing?

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What I mean is this, we have no GM's and don't expect any but, there IS griefing and everyone knows of it, like today, I logged in to find an a$$ had practically built in my backyard, I asked wth and he said he wasn't going to put up any gates to block it or anything but it is right at my back door, not only that, he blocked me off from the beach and he has a large portion of the beach so he has put up pillars and foundations allllll over the place including encroaching on mine which I wouldn't mind so much if he didn't take it all!!! So in turn, I put pillars between his foundations, I have left information as to where to reach me when I am not on so we can compromise, he said he didn't want  trouble but yet he is still cutting me off so I ask the Dev's, what sort of retaliation should be done in this instance as it will not be fixed turning in a ticket, please, help me understand here. If I did wrong let me know what I should have done.

I am not the only one,there are so many fights going on on a daily basis of people blocking their ships, their bases just stuff that is uncalled for and makes no sense.

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I understand your decision about setting up pillars between his foundations, but I think the wisest thing to do is to remove them. Imagine for a moment this guy reports you and you're the one who ends up with a punishment. I don't know how big or little the chances are, but I'd be worried about that if I were you. 

There are situations, like the one you explain above, that leave no room for doubts about whether a player is purposefully doing something to bother you or not. I switched to PvE long time ago and I realised the griefing can be extremely annoying. I've had two issues regarding this since I started playing again after the wipe, and both of them were related to random players killing animals while they were caged and entrapped. The last one was a chinese guy who was roaming around with his bear while I was taming a giraffe. The guy would stop by every now and then and after 5 minutes or so he dismounted, got close to the giraffe and shot it dead while it was entrapped. He then said 'sorry' in chat then proceeded to play emotes, basically laughter and dance. A guy was laughing at my face after ruining my tame and I couldn't do absolutely anything about it.

I obviously reported him and one day later I got this message about devs looking into it and how they will not let me know the outcome of it because of data privacy or something like that, but I am quite sure nothing will be done against him. This game is unintentionally designed to give griefers all sorts of ways to ruin your day, and I think that's pretty hard for the devs to manage.

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I've seen it happen since the launch in 2018 and it still happens today. People tell me that the devs do listen when you submit tickets but if they do they must only hand pick them at random and click discard on the rest because i've submitted a ticket in the past along with 4 others about the same thing and it went ignore, we just had to live with it which we shouldn't have to do

Before the wipe many months ago I was on M5, there was a big island that had sunstone gems on and I needed them so went to get some. When I got there someone had put a wooden hut around all of them so they could farm them and store them inside. Many of us submitted tickets, went unheard so another company took matters into his own hands and built a huge and I mean huge thatch wooden box around his little hut so he couldn't get the gems over the wall for himself. I came back the next day to notice the signs up saying "you take your wall down and we will take ours down" I did laugh over it though but it's been that way for a long time.

Many now resort to fighting fire with fire, i've seen other players building those huge walls around them until they back down and it works but risky if the devs do actually see it then you are stuffed.

The island I am on now, the same thing has happened, gems have been covered again which is why I have never bothered to play it much, this is supposed to be PvE but we are forced into using underhand tactics of doing the same. It's the same when you start off, you see the foundation spam and think I am not going to have anywhere to build here so you resort to placing them yourself, the game is messed up, always has been.

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26 minutes ago, Christopher Blake said:

I understand your decision about setting up pillars between his foundations, but I think the wisest thing to do is to remove them. Imagine for a moment this guy reports you and you're the one who ends up with a punishment. I don't know how big or little the chances are, but I'd be worried about that if I were you. 

There are situations, like the one you explain above, that leave no room for doubts about whether a player is purposefully doing something to bother you or not. I switched to PvE long time ago and I realised the griefing can be extremely annoying. I've had two issues regarding this since I started playing again after the wipe, and both of them were related to random players killing animals while they were caged and entrapped. The last one was a chinese guy who was roaming around with his bear while I was taming a giraffe. The guy would stop by every now and then and after 5 minutes or so he dismounted, got close to the giraffe and shot it dead while it was entrapped. He then said 'sorry' in chat then proceeded to play emotes, basically laughter and dance. A guy was laughing at my face after ruining my tame and I couldn't do absolutely anything about it.

I obviously reported him and one day later I got this message about devs looking into it and how they will not let me know the outcome of it because of data privacy or something like that, but I am quite sure nothing will be done against him. This game is unintentionally designed to give griefers all sorts of ways to ruin your day, and I think that's pretty hard for the devs to manage.

I will think on what you say although, he has them in my space I feel only justified in having them in his but, I will give a think on it I am open to compromise and have left info where to get a hold of me for that compromise after all he is the one going to be cutting off resources but,thanks for the advice  I will take it to heart 🙂

As far as it being hard for devs to manage I disagree, they can appoint GM's for those situations that are actual players and have someone come into the mix to make compromises if one is willing to compromise then it should be a win win situation really and, getting GM's to do just that would not be a hard thing to do just, effort...

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16 minutes ago, DannyUK said:

I've seen it happen since the launch in 2018 and it still happens today. People tell me that the devs do listen when you submit tickets but if they do they must only hand pick them at random and click discard on the rest because i've submitted a ticket in the past along with 4 others about the same thing and it went ignore, we just had to live with it which we shouldn't have to do

Before the wipe many months ago I was on M5, there was a big island that had sunstone gems on and I needed them so went to get some. When I got there someone had put a wooden hut around all of them so they could farm them and store them inside. Many of us submitted tickets, went unheard so another company took matters into his own hands and built a huge and I mean huge thatch wooden box around his little hut so he couldn't get the gems over the wall for himself. I came back the next day to notice the signs up saying "you take your wall down and we will take ours down" I did laugh over it though but it's been that way for a long time.

Many now resort to fighting fire with fire, i've seen other players building those huge walls around them until they back down and it works but risky if the devs do actually see it then you are stuffed.

The island I am on now, the same thing has happened, gems have been covered again which is why I have never bothered to play it much, this is supposed to be PvE but we are forced into using underhand tactics of doing the same. It's the same when you start off, you see the foundation spam and think I am not going to have anywhere to build here so you resort to placing them yourself, the game is messed up, always has been.

I think a simple fix would be to take on General Managers that are players, ones that they have seen post that have common sense and can be unbiased, they are out there!

As far as ticket submitting I have to say they have been very good to me but, the only ones I have submitted have been when battleye messed with me and wouldn't let me on or, kept kicking me they did fix that in a timely manner quiet a few times so I have to say they are good in that area.

As far as the griefing goes that you mentioned and that I stated,it is really a general I don't want to say assumption? But that is what it is until say like a GM or a Dev actually takes a look at the situation with their eyes not just words, anyone could get a lot of their friends to write in and complain on one person to get them booted is an example of what I mean so that is why eyes are actually called for and to have eyes you need GM's. That is my opinion though.

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This happens all the time in conan exiles, but the decay timer is a lot lower. and normally the people who do it move on anyway. When I played Ark someone griefed me by putting pipes all the way round my cabin. When that didn't work they surrounded my hut with massive dinos. In the end I had so much lag I couldn't actually play anymore. I wouldn't have minded if I had built a massive base but it was only about 8 blocks square. It was a massive tribe too, they just thought it was funny. Stopped me playing ark for good tbh.

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Posted (edited)

Ill say this actually, i think players acting as GMs potentially opens a giant can of worms unless implemented perfectly and policed regularly.

 

Building and claiming are fundamental game mechanics that need work and should be high priority and theres several better solutions.

 

GL yall and have fun

Edited by Ranger1k
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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, SusanT said:

that is why eyes are actually called for and to have eyes you need GM's. That is my opinion though.

If the mechanics are correct then eyes on sight situations are low. Griefing in games is a fact. If it can be done it will be... Therefore structure the game so it can't be done. Period. That is the only correct answer.

 

To everyone posting hopefully you know I'm not critical of your statements 😉 and i apologize if i sound harsh

Edited by Ranger1k
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1 hour ago, Whitehawk said:

This happens all the time in conan exiles, but the decay timer is a lot lower. and normally the people who do it move on anyway. When I played Ark someone griefed me by putting pipes all the way round my cabin. When that didn't work they surrounded my hut with massive dinos. In the end I had so much lag I couldn't actually play anymore. I wouldn't have minded if I had built a massive base but it was only about 8 blocks square. It was a massive tribe too, they just thought it was funny. Stopped me playing ark for good tbh.

That ticks me off for you to be honest, I too was griefed badly in Ark so much so that I haven't went back to play it in over a year I do have to say though that Wild Card DID wipe them, it was later found out they were wrecking people' places and kiting those extinction dinos to their bases to kill their dino's then selling them dinos but, they charged them real currency to buy them.....anyway can't get rid of trash like that I too was a solo player and they wiped my little place out like I was some sort of threat.

To me those type of people are not only complete jerks, they are scared, they are too scared to go play on pvp so they have to pick on people in pve games, like  Blake was talking about above about them killing his tame, just no sense in it other than they are too chicken to go play on pvp because they can and get away with it, I have learned though a very, very good trick on how someone isn't going to ever kill one of my tames again at least on the bears!

 

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1 hour ago, Ranger1k said:

If the mechanics are correct then eyes on sight situations are low. Griefing in games is a fact. If it can be done it will be... Therefore structure the game so it can't be done. Period. That is the only correct answer.

 

To everyone posting hopefully you know I'm not critical of your statements 😉 and i apologize if i sound harsh

I have seen your post before, you are just compassionate lolol anyway how on earth would they be able to structure it so griefing can't be done? I just can't see how that would be possible but I do get it about the GM as other players could hold sway over them but, if they GM's have any complaints about them then, it could be investigated.

If there weren't so many stupid tickets turned in in the first place things would move a lot smoother, I have heard of some really stupid tickets and thought " OMG then people wonder why they never get around to them ". 

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4 hours ago, Christopher Blake said:

I understand your decision about setting up pillars between his foundations, but I think the wisest thing to do is to remove them. Imagine for a moment this guy reports you and you're the one who ends up with a punishment. I don't know how big or little the chances are, but I'd be worried about that if I were you. 

There are situations, like the one you explain above, that leave no room for doubts about whether a player is purposefully doing something to bother you or not. I switched to PvE long time ago and I realised the griefing can be extremely annoying. I've had two issues regarding this since I started playing again after the wipe, and both of them were related to random players killing animals while they were caged and entrapped. The last one was a chinese guy who was roaming around with his bear while I was taming a giraffe. The guy would stop by every now and then and after 5 minutes or so he dismounted, got close to the giraffe and shot it dead while it was entrapped. He then said 'sorry' in chat then proceeded to play emotes, basically laughter and dance. A guy was laughing at my face after ruining my tame and I couldn't do absolutely anything about it.

I obviously reported him and one day later I got this message about devs looking into it and how they will not let me know the outcome of it because of data privacy or something like that, but I am quite sure nothing will be done against him. This game is unintentionally designed to give griefers all sorts of ways to ruin your day, and I think that's pretty hard for the devs to manage.

I did as you suggested and removed them, silly of me to put them up to start with as I am grown sigh. Thanx

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1 hour ago, SusanT said:

I have seen your post before, you are just compassionate lolol anyway how on earth would they be able to structure it so griefing can't be done?

     Im happy offer some friendly advice as a show of good intention and to network. Also "griefing" is both a player experience and a playstyle so making it 100% impossible isn't possible if humans interact on a platform. I mispoke. I admit it. Woops 😏 

      Let me restate my position. It could easily be reduced substantially. Very substantially. Other forum members have proposed some teneble methods if the devs want to keep the current business model. I don't. The model is flawed. Flawed business model = flawed game.

     If they want the juicy stuff, Im available to provide the company with direct professional consulting. Almost 40 years AS an rpg gamer. Other credentials. Simply stated, i know how to make this product WAY more fun and popular, with a ridiculous ROI.

 

     Sorry to be a vague tease but what would i be if i just gave it away for free, to anyone, w out developing a relationship lol 😁

 

    Some things just cant be given away for free, not by me atleast, got kids to feed. Im talkin big picture, industry changing things in addition to addressing the flaws in the fundamental mechanics and implementation. 

 

No further comment. Haters gonna hate (not talkin about you SusanT) 

Ranger out 👍

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1 hour ago, Ranger1k said:

     Im happy offer some friendly advice as a show of good intention and to network. Also "griefing" is both a player experience and a playstyle so making it 100% impossible isn't possible if humans interact on a platform. I mispoke. I admit it. Woops 😏 

      Let me restate my position. It could easily be reduced substantially. Very substantially. Other forum members have proposed some teneble methods if the devs want to keep the current business model. I don't. The model is flawed. Flawed business model = flawed game.

     If they want the juicy stuff, Im available to provide the company with direct professional consulting. Almost 40 years AS an rpg gamer. Other credentials. Simply stated, i know how to make this product WAY more fun and popular, with a ridiculous ROI.

 

     Sorry to be a vague tease but what would i be if i just gave it away for free, to anyone, w out developing a relationship lol 😁

 

    Some things just cant be given away for free, not by me atleast, got kids to feed. Im talkin big picture, industry changing things in addition to addressing the flaws in the fundamental mechanics and implementation. 

 

No further comment. Haters gonna hate (not talkin about you SusanT) 

Ranger out 👍

LOL no worries 🙂 Thanks for the info though! Maybe they will give you a notice to contact 🙂

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, SusanT said:

What I mean is this, we have no GM's and don't expect any but, there IS griefing and everyone knows of it, like today, I logged in to find an a$$ had practically built in my backyard, I asked wth and he said he wasn't going to put up any gates to block it or anything but it is right at my back door, not only that, he blocked me off from the beach and he has a large portion of the beach so he has put up pillars and foundations allllll over the place including encroaching on mine which I wouldn't mind so much if he didn't take it all!!! So in turn, I put pillars between his foundations, I have left information as to where to reach me when I am not on so we can compromise, he said he didn't want  trouble but yet he is still cutting me off so I ask the Dev's, what sort of retaliation should be done in this instance as it will not be fixed turning in a ticket, please, help me understand here. If I did wrong let me know what I should have done.

I am not the only one,there are so many fights going on on a daily basis of people blocking their ships, their bases just stuff that is uncalled for and makes no sense.

What it comes down to is your fortitude. Regardless of what anyone tells you, grieving is grieving. If you stoop to their level(at any point regardless) you are just as horrible as they are and there is no excuse for it, o don’t care what they did. 
 

if you kill someone you are a muster and if you grieve someone you are a griever. I love it when people act like there is a gray area which there is not. Because regardless of the reason why you killed someone(self defense) you still killed someone lmao, and regardless of the reason you grieve someone(they did it first) you are still a griever. 
 

please take that into consideration because by definition those are the only two options. You either are one of them or you are not. Most definitely black and white without any shade of gray let alone 50.

Edited by Pooter
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11 hours ago, SusanT said:

What I mean is this, we have no GM's and don't expect any but, there IS griefing and everyone knows of it, like today, I logged in to find an a$$ had practically built in my backyard, I asked wth and he said he wasn't going to put up any gates to block it or anything but it is right at my back door, not only that, he blocked me off from the beach and he has a large portion of the beach so he has put up pillars and foundations allllll over the place including encroaching on mine which I wouldn't mind so much if he didn't take it all!!! So in turn, I put pillars between his foundations, I have left information as to where to reach me when I am not on so we can compromise, he said he didn't want  trouble but yet he is still cutting me off so I ask the Dev's, what sort of retaliation should be done in this instance as it will not be fixed turning in a ticket, please, help me understand here. If I did wrong let me know what I should have done.

I am not the only one,there are so many fights going on on a daily basis of people blocking their ships, their bases just stuff that is uncalled for and makes no sense.

I just had someone pillar and gate spam my boats by building into them, because she was super pissed I built 5 small bases near some resource nodes.

That's griefing/exploiting. Go to the contact page and report it if they do not remove their stuff.

What you're saying isn't griefing exploiting.

See what you're doing is illegal here https://www.playatlas.com/index.php?/code-of-conduct/

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12 hours ago, Pooter said:

What it comes down to is your fortitude. Regardless of what anyone tells you, grieving is grieving. If you stoop to their level(at any point regardless) you are just as horrible as they are and there is no excuse for it, o don’t care what they did. 
 

if you kill someone you are a muster and if you grieve someone you are a griever. I love it when people act like there is a gray area which there is not. Because regardless of the reason why you killed someone(self defense) you still killed someone lmao, and regardless of the reason you grieve someone(they did it first) you are still a griever. 
 

please take that into consideration because by definition those are the only two options. You either are one of them or you are not. Most definitely black and white without any shade of gray let alone 50.

 I do get what you are saying, there is NO grey area in that situation, none at all you either are one or you are not, AGREED.

As far as killing someone? There are allllll sorts of grey areas there so DISAGREE there, a killer and self defense are two totally different animals facts being what separates one from the other, the end result is no grey area as dead is dead, it's that in between that is so shaded so no, imo it is NOT so black and white.

 

After all of this talk of grey I must go listen to some Mr. Jones w Grey guitar by Counting Crows been too long:)

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10 hours ago, gadefence said:

I just had someone pillar and gate spam my boats by building into them, because she was super pissed I built 5 small bases near some resource nodes.

That's griefing/exploiting. Go to the contact page and report it if they do not remove their stuff.

What you're saying isn't griefing exploiting.

See what you're doing is illegal here https://www.playatlas.com/index.php?/code-of-conduct/

*Exploiting
Attacking or blocking players through the terrain
Blocking players through the terrain is my problem still standing. Can't access beach. But he will not be an adult nor stop being a plain pig about the land and will continue his actions, sometimes you just have to let go it is only a game but, an awesome game! Whoot!

*Extreme cases of utilizing structures on lawless servers with an aim to prevent inhibit what can reasonably be considered regular play. <Highly subjective.

I will think about reporting it as you suggested above they have been really good to me as far as fixing my character in the past like I have said before and even made a shout out forum title about it, as long as it is precise and concise and of course with courtesy they usually will fix it. It's when players send in reports with their emotions involved and where as the actual fact of the situation is lost and leaving the people who fix the problems scratching their heads, they do not have time for guessing games I so totally get that.

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Both others and myself have had variations on this idea..

Beachfronts should be pre divided, visibly on land like a risk map, into claimable zones. Period. Problem solved. Enough room for a moderate base, shipyards, oceanview and inland access. Problem solved zero eyes on site required beyond initial set up and nuanced followup. Ez pz

Edited by Ranger1k
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I said this in a different post but the response I had filling out a ticket for inappropriate conduct (resource blocking and basic island blockage) was taken care of in less than 5 days. The GM wiped all of it and it blew my mind. The ticket information is a pain to collect but it shows them your serious. It gave me real hope for the future of PVE that someone cared enough handle the issue.

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2 hours ago, Ranger1k said:

Both others and myself have had variations on this idea..

Beachfronts should be pre divided, visibly on land like a risk map, into claimable zones. Period. Problem solved. Enough room for a moderate base, shipyards, oceanview and inland access. Problem solved zero eyes on site required beyond initial set up and nuanced followup. Ez pz

wargaming has used hex maps for territory control for years for reasons that it works.   Just make them small enough hex grid so the shoreline can be followed, but not so small that blocking fences can be built.

 

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Considering they want to encourage trading they should do what pirate: caribbean hunt did. Instanced islands you own, everything else it lawless. The islands you own are basically shelled out rocks with few resources forcing trading and more piracy.

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6 hours ago, Gomez Addams said:

I said this in a different post but the response I had filling out a ticket for inappropriate conduct (resource blocking and basic island blockage) was taken care of in less than 5 days. The GM wiped all of it and it blew my mind. The ticket information is a pain to collect but it shows them your serious. It gave me real hope for the future of PVE that someone cared enough handle the issue.

Well that's a first, must have pulled their fingers out. I will remember this and report in the future then, never bothered after the last one went unanswered. 

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2 hours ago, DannyUK said:

Well that's a first, must have pulled their fingers out. I will remember this and report in the future then, never bothered after the last one went unanswered. 

There was a LOT of griefing going on at first. I think they have more support now - also they work better on PvE as their general view of PvP is "you got cannons deal with it". My mate had 6 of his friends get banned in the last few months.

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8 hours ago, Gomez Addams said:

I said this in a different post but the response I had filling out a ticket for inappropriate conduct (resource blocking and basic island blockage) was taken care of in less than 5 days. The GM wiped all of it and it blew my mind. The ticket information is a pain to collect but it shows them your serious. It gave me real hope for the future of PVE that someone cared enough handle the issue.

I agree totally, you give them concise and precise information and pics if they can be supplied as that will be the kicker.Glad you were helped 🙂

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