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George Catcher

We don't need any more ship types.

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I often see forum messages like: "WE WANNA MORE SHIP TYPES IN THE GAME" I mean, it would be cool if there were a lot of different ship types. And I feel sad to talk about it. But let's take a sober look at current ship state.

So. Difference between ships should be:

- Hold size.

- Sturdiness.

- Amount of cannons.

- Speed and maneuverability.

And we should actually choice our vessel because of current mission needs (it's like that - we wouldn't wanna sail Frigate to nearest island, because we will unanchor it and then park back like for ever).

And what do we have right now?

- Hold size doesn't matter. We can put all of our cargo in to small chest in ship corner.

- Sturdiness doesn't matter, because we can enforce our ship armor with additional roofs, walls, and ceilings and enforce it more with skills.

c1cuPXe.jpg

- Amount of gunports goesn't matter because we can add extra 20 cannons to our brig and even 10 more to stern and 10 more to ship nose.

maxresdefault.jpg

- We have largest and fastest ship in a game. Why would we want slower and smaller? And maneuverability is important in boardside battles, but no one does that. Just usual chasing tactic and nose-stern cannons shoot.

So... we've basically got everything we need. Wanna more different type of ship - use current base and create different types with roofs, ceilings, walls, different sails, and custom amount of cannons.

If ship type would depend how many cargo it can carry (I'm not talking about weight, but size). How strong firepower it can carry, etc. Then we would wanna more ship types. But to make so - there are a lot of dramatic design restriction should be introduced! like no more guns out of gunports, no more roofs armor etc.

Until then (and again I sad to say that) we simply don't need any more ship types.

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While it would be nice to see more types of ships in Atlas, people will always cookie cutter the same type every time.

Some thing they could do, and it would even be within the skill level of this dev team, if they ever get back to working on this game. Is to have different base values for stats and coresponding increases per level. So you would have differing roles for the same ship type.

 

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I've seen people play Naval Action but never played it myself I noticed in that game though you can send ships away on expeditions or to another point and you wait for it to get there in so many hours. I wish this was in Atlas, the NPC control the ship to go to a certain area while you do something else (for the smaller or solo companies of course and single player)

I'd be happy with the current ships, if only they added more content to the game, I mean 1 year in and you'd expect abit more to be honest.

The wind and weather has to change for me to be playing more again, I don't mind waiting while travelling but after awhile when the wind is against you all the time it's no fun and the boredom creeps in.

What happened to the NPC camps? They should be in the game by now to give people something extra to do.

The devs have tried to balance Ark and Atlas and it has severely backfired on them, why they split the dev team I will never know, all Dollie and Jat are posting about on Twitter is "how is everyone enjoying Ark" "what would you like to see more?" they have lost the plot.

I had hope for the game but with the numbers dropping I don't see it being as good as it was supposed to be. New World out in a few months, another MMO and numbers will fade even more. They haven't listened to anything the community has said and that is their downfall. I've had my fun with it though don't get me wrong but argh it gets me angry at how good it could be and they watch it fade away.

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I think there should be a distinction between merchant ships and warships.
If we limit the number of cannons on a ship, we may be able to sail on more diverse ships.

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we talked about this from the start...

My thoughts still are
- they should only allow guns in gun port structures, with them being also on the top deck... get rid of the front/rear shotguns...
- if cannons only fit in gun ports they can make easy cross count so that too many cannons on one side gives balance problems...
- for free placing of fire power the swivels are for, give them a small ball ammo... or allow Puckles as they are really designed as ship CIWS anyway...
- with the cannon-to-gun port change we need atleast a new ship in between the brig and gally... having like 12-18 gunports each side...
- have to change the SOTD aswell, so they also have no turret cannons and shoot most of them broadside... or switch over to the single player pirate ships...
- to customize ships further have three typs of planks: normal, cargo, armored... having different buffs and de-buffs...
- make the normal wood structures damage pass through... thin sheet of wood will not stop a cannon ball like a thick plank can... actually the splintering wood makes it more lethal for the crew...

But hey, it seems to be too difficult to make new ships, as the one we have are from the time this was just a player made mod... the knowledge seems to be lost...
And even with new ships and/or significant changes to the ship game, Atlas is still lost, as there are way more other problems killing the game...

and no one there to fix them...

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Posted (edited)

OP is spoken like someone who doesn't know how to build a ship.

The screenshot of the ship you posted is a common newb boat. 1) no swivels so it can be boarded and 2) damage is too spread out. Way to many points in crew and weight (25 points by the looks of it). Not enough firepower concentrated in any direction.

Ship speeds are also already different. Brigs handle better than schooners, schooners are faster, galleons are fastest on paper but not in practice, and handle like dog shit. Only reason galleons go dual broad side is cause they handle so bad.

If you armor your boat up super heavy like that, you are not able to level up resistance as much, you have to level weight, and all ships are pretty tight on weight when you run with 300 or so cannon balls and the suggested gunport cannons. You pass 50% weight you slow down quite a bit, the big boys run at 30% weight. Any points you put in weight are less points in damage/resistance.

20 points in resistance and 20 points in damage and 4 points in crew and 5 points in weight is kind of the meta for mythical boats. For non-mythical boats you generally just want 15 resists 15 damage 4 crew 5 weight, 10 cannon broadside, 2 extra crew for players. A 25/25 damage/melee galleon (18 cannons each side * 1.8 blueprint * 2 from levels = 65 normal cannon barrage) broadside will shit on that brig and any other. There needs to be something like a "destroyer" that has a chance at taking down galleons. I mean 54 crew points is HUGE advantage over the 16 we get on a brig. The amount of resources/planks/decks needed is also WAY higher on Galleon.

We could use something in between. Like brig plank count that uses large planks but uses the extra deck for cannons.

Edited by Bleakwise

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On 2/28/2020 at 10:36 PM, Jack Shandy said:

While it would be nice to see more types of ships in Atlas, people will always cookie cutter the same type every time.

Some thing they could do, and it would even be within the skill level of this dev team, if they ever get back to working on this game. Is to have different base values for stats and coresponding increases per level. So you would have differing roles for the same ship type.

 

Actually in Solo I'd love to try different builds. A small little ship for nipping round my island home, a schooner for general exploration, a brig designed for hauling cargo and a giant man of war to symbolize my merchants might even if I never use it. Then a whole range of differnet designs for specific purposees like animal hauling vs frieght hauling. The issue is the fleets of the damned for you to build the best (current) ship vs ship design, the best (current) run away design or the be sunk repeatedly and lose all your work design. I don't need more ship types, I need fewer ships of the damned and it'll get me back into playing AND allow me to create different ships for the existing hull sizes.

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The trouble is, without introducing more ship types (even more realistic options would be a start). Then what is atlas? just an ark dlc. After all they constantly add more tames to please players, but if we wanted more tames we could just play ark. I and many others bought atlas for the pyracy and for the ship building. Otherwise, why bother releasing atlas separately at all? 

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8 hours ago, Whitehawk said:

The trouble is, without introducing more ship types (even more realistic options would be a start). Then what is atlas? just an ark dlc. After all they constantly add more tames to please players, but if we wanted more tames we could just play ark. I and many others bought atlas for the pyracy and for the ship building. Otherwise, why bother releasing atlas separately at all? 

What have they been adding lately?  Anything since the Oct 7th patch were they add some new islands and...wait for it...CATS!!!

 

That's the problem.  They aren't adding new ship types, they aren't adding tames.  They aren't adding PVE mobs.  For nearly 5 months.  And it's been what?  Four months since XBox release?  The major addition before that was the Blackwood map in August.  June was the last time an actual mount was added.  

Seriously, you're whining about tames and they've added FOUR since the game launched.  The Crab, Tortugar, Olfend and Cats.  That's it.  When I started playing Ark, which was early November 2015, they added more tames by December first that we've gotten in nearly 15 months!

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I'm not moaning about more tames at all, i'm stating that it's either a pyrate game or an ark dlc, and we have loadsa tames and barely any ships and yeh they did add a few tames to the already large number we can have . but they added no ships at all. In a sailing pyrate game.

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16 minutes ago, Whitehawk said:

I'm not moaning about more tames at all, i'm stating that it's either a pyrate game or an ark dlc, and we have loadsa tames and barely any ships and yeh they did add a few tames to the already large number we can have . but they added no ships at all. In a sailing pyrate game.

They can't add new ship classes.  The current ship classes are too resource intensive server-wise.  Things like Ships of the Damned or NPCs are much easier to add.

And for it being an "pirate game", what separates Atlas from competitors ARE the tames.  With out them you basically get a poor man's Sea of Thieves or whatever next game that comes along.  They need to embrace that aspect, not run away from it.

And yes, you were whining about tames and insisting that we can only have ships OR tames exclusively.  You want less of a game because you don't like the aspect of the game.  I don't like boss fights, but you don't hear me whining about the Kraken or the Snowman or Power Stone Islands.  I'm not asking for those aspects of the game to be removed even though I have no use for them.

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Frankly, you obviously just want to rant and vent at someone so go ahead and waste your time. I've played atlas since pc release and also play it on the xbox too. through every wipe I might add and I still came back and still play. I think i've earned the right to an opinion on where the game is headed. And imo Atlas needs to break away from ark completely and stand on it's own now.But by all means, use petty arguments and rant on. But you'll be talking to yourself, believe me.

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They would add more ship types if they could.

WTF guys. Pull your head in.

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6 hours ago, Whitehawk said:

Frankly, you obviously just want to rant and vent at someone so go ahead and waste your time. I've played atlas since pc release and also play it on the xbox too. through every wipe I might add and I still came back and still play. I think i've earned the right to an opinion on where the game is headed. And imo Atlas needs to break away from ark completely and stand on it's own now.But by all means, use petty arguments and rant on. But you'll be talking to yourself, believe me.

There have been people since launch saying the "only" way to make the game distinguishable from Ark is reduce taming.  Instead what they, the devs and you are talking about is making the Atlas the same cookie cutter experience for every play.  What they NEED to do is fully embrace the massive open world they have.  Add to that to make this game different.  But that's HARD and nerfing tames into the ground and making them useless would be so much EASIER for the devs.

Players are different and will want to different things.  Should a player or company be able to play Atlas w/o ever having to harvest resources or tame animals?  Sure.  If those players are going out treasure hunting, fighting SotD and other gold giving gameplay was added, then they should be able to go to a port and buy what they need from a Commodities Market (get arid of the vendor).  Owning island should be a source of passive income, not resource sinks.  Add more ports, have less freeports.  Give people who like to tame and like to gather resources a place to sell them.  (Yeah, that happens in game now, but actual market places to greatly improve a player based economy).  

What is winning in a survival game?  It's chasing other people off the server.  Because that's the case, battles (sea and land) as well as Wars need to have new victory conditions.  Both how to "win" and what you win.  (Because even the mega-pvp companies leave when they finally get wiped by someone else). 

 

Instead of pushing a certain, same gameplay on people, they need to expand the horizons well beyond their Ark-style thinking were they want everyone following a fairly narrow gameplay path.  What you want is the latter.

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On 2/28/2020 at 11:47 AM, George Catcher said:

I often see forum messages like: "WE WANNA MORE SHIP TYPES IN THE GAME" I mean, it would be cool if there were a lot of different ship types. And I feel sad to talk about it. But let's take a sober look at current ship state.

So. Difference between ships should be:

- Hold size.

- Sturdiness.

- Amount of cannons.

- Speed and maneuverability.

And we should actually choice our vessel because of current mission needs (it's like that - we wouldn't wanna sail Frigate to nearest island, because we will unanchor it and then park back like for ever).

And what do we have right now?

- Hold size doesn't matter. We can put all of our cargo in to small chest in ship corner.

- Sturdiness doesn't matter, because we can enforce our ship armor with additional roofs, walls, and ceilings and enforce it more with skills.

c1cuPXe.jpg

- Amount of gunports goesn't matter because we can add extra 20 cannons to our brig and even 10 more to stern and 10 more to ship nose.

maxresdefault.jpg

- We have largest and fastest ship in a game. Why would we want slower and smaller? And maneuverability is important in boardside battles, but no one does that. Just usual chasing tactic and nose-stern cannons shoot.

So... we've basically got everything we need. Wanna more different type of ship - use current base and create different types with roofs, ceilings, walls, different sails, and custom amount of cannons.

If ship type would depend how many cargo it can carry (I'm not talking about weight, but size). How strong firepower it can carry, etc. Then we would wanna more ship types. But to make so - there are a lot of dramatic design restriction should be introduced! like no more guns out of gunports, no more roofs armor etc.

Until then (and again I sad to say that) we simply don't need any more ship types.

 

do you know why i bought the game? ocean content, not tames, not pvp, nothing else, ocean content. and surprise surprise for that you need a ship that fits your style and necessities, do you need tames in a normal naval combat pirate themed game? no,  are they a bad thing? no, is it ok the fact that we have more than 20 different types of pets and only 4 types of boats? no, why? because thats not what they advertised, if you pay for a tv but you get a fridge instead would you be happy? also your post's title is quite arrogant, who appointed you as the community representative? YOU dont want more types of boats, i do.

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31 minutes ago, The D Legacy said:

 

do you know why i bought the game? ocean content, not tames, not pvp, nothing else, ocean content. and surprise surprise for that you need a ship that fits your style and necessities, do you need tames in a normal naval combat pirate themed game? no,  are they a bad thing? no, is it ok the fact that we have more than 20 different types of pets and only 4 types of boats? no, why? because thats not what they advertised, if you pay for a tv but you get a fridge instead would you be happy? also your post's title is quite arrogant, who appointed you as the community representative? YOU dont want more types of boats, i do.

Except they advertised it as a Pirate-themed Survival PvP game.  

I could nitpick more about your statement, but I have a question instead.  Honest question.  What kind of additional ocean content did you expect?  Beyond the obvious "more kinds of ships".

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  • Cargo hold
  • Sturdiness
  • Cannon mounts
  • Speed
  • Maneuverability

That makes five (5) unique Attributes, which can have a low value, a high value or something in between.

If there were enough ships in the game right now, please tell me: Which is the ship that has a huge cargo hold, does have low hp, low speed and only few cannons?

This five dimensional space of ships is definitely 4 dimensions too many for grapeshot to get a grasp on.

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10 hours ago, Slash78 said:

Except they advertised it as a Pirate-themed Survival PvP game.  

I could nitpick more about your statement, but I have a question instead.  Honest question.  What kind of additional ocean content did you expect?  Beyond the obvious "more kinds of ships".

and what part of "Pirate-themed Survival PvP game" includes the word "Tame Based"???

I was not pre-disposed/expectant of a specific type of ocean content, but tames are not ocean content, and lets be clear that i dont dislike them but if they have time to design more than 20 tames it is only logical they could have designed less pets and more actual ocean content. as they correctly stated in the live stream they overdid the pets part and also "forced" players to spend way too much time at land.

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YOU dont want more types of boats, i do.

What I was trying to say is - all ship concept should change. Because in current state - it just made wrong. If I would do the pirate naval game - I would make it totally different way. 

- No free design, no walls, roofs, ceiling, no free cannon placement.

- Just frame, planks, deck, one piece of ragging (all masts, ropes, cables, ladders) with spots for sails.

- Guns just in gunports.

- Insides of ship are filled with "modules", which are: living rooms for crew, cargo holds (each one has limited cargo capacity), supply room with cooking spots, tames cages, etc.

And only in this state - we would wanna more ships. Like I mentioned here - 26 ships in 6 classes (each class is different size, sturdiness, and can carry it's own cannons from 16 to 42 pounds cannonballs)

 

 

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8 hours ago, The D Legacy said:

and what part of "Pirate-themed Survival PvP game" includes the word "Tame Based"???

I was not pre-disposed/expectant of a specific type of ocean content, but tames are not ocean content, and lets be clear that i dont dislike them but if they have time to design more than 20 tames it is only logical they could have designed less pets and more actual ocean content. as they correctly stated in the live stream they overdid the pets part and also "forced" players to spend way too much time at land.

Let me ask the question again, what kind of ocean content?  Through some ideas out there.

I don't see this as an exclusively A or B issue.  The fact is we AREN'T getting ocean content, we aren't getting tames, we aren't getting new boats, NPCs aren't getting an increase role.

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1 hour ago, Slash78 said:

Let me ask the question again, what kind of ocean content?  Through some ideas out there.

I don't see this as an exclusively A or B issue.  The fact is we AREN'T getting ocean content, we aren't getting tames, we aren't getting new boats, NPCs aren't getting an increase role.

so you ignore everythng else i said and the topic at hand and focus on an unrelated question? i have already made long suggestion ideas posts in the past, it was a waste of my time when i was playing and would be a waste even more now that i quit.

can you demonstrate your facts? because if you cant then they are not facts they are assumptions, but i agree you guys are not getting anything simply because this game was created only to found other projects wich already did.

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Just now, The D Legacy said:

so you ignore everythng else i said and the topic at hand and focus on an unrelated question? i have already made long suggestion ideas posts in the past, it was a waste of my time when i was playing and would be a waste even more now that i quit.

can you demonstrate your facts? because if you cant then they are not facts they are assumptions, but i agree you guys are not getting anything simply because this game was created only to found other projects wich already did.

Ok, the same part of "Pirate Theme Survival Game" that has you fighting Cyclopes, Whaling and hunt Yeti.  That's the same kind of "Pirate" game where you should be able to spend your days riding around on a Tiger with a Rabbit on your shoulder.

If you did post stuff like that, then put some links in here or PM them to me.

As for more ships, you will NEVER seem me say they don't need more ships.  

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2 hours ago, Slash78 said:

Ok, the same part of "Pirate Theme Survival Game" that has you fighting Cyclopes, Whaling and hunt Yeti.  That's the same kind of "Pirate" game where you should be able to spend your days riding around on a Tiger with a Rabbit on your shoulder.

If you did post stuff like that, then put some links in here or PM them to me.

As for more ships, you will NEVER seem me say they don't need more ships.  

wrong, according to the steam tags wich serve as a reference to describe the game, fighting cyclopes yetis and whaling would fall under fantasy and adventure.

i would post a screenshot but this stupid forum wont allow me to upload an image bigger than 10Kb, yes 10 Kb, because they can be this pathetic in 2020...

you are free to browse through my profile and see my posts, i wont be spending my own time with that simply because i have no reason to.

you will never ask for more ships.. ok... your point?

 

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, The D Legacy said:

wrong, according to the steam tags wich serve as a reference to describe the game, fighting cyclopes yetis and whaling would fall under fantasy and adventure.

i would post a screenshot but this stupid forum wont allow me to upload an image bigger than 10Kb, yes 10 Kb, because they can be this pathetic in 2020...

you are free to browse through my profile and see my posts, i wont be spending my own time with that simply because i have no reason to.

you will never ask for more ships.. ok... your point?

 

 

I HAVE asked for more ships, several times and I will NEVER say we don't need more ships.  

 

Edit:  Here's a link of me asking for more ships from over a year ago...

 

Edited by Slash78
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17 hours ago, Slash78 said:

I HAVE asked for more ships, several times and I will NEVER say we don't need more ships.  

 

Edit:  Here's a link of me asking for more ships from over a year ago...

 

oh my bad i missread you apparently.

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