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Gemini Five

Long sea trips - Need fast travel

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the most grids you will ever travel is 7 in any direction , if you have traveled 14 grids then are doing it wrong u appear on the opposite side of map if you go to edges , so it will alwatyys be only 7 grids travel no matter where u start or want to go 

 

 

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1 hour ago, UDO said:

the most grids you will ever travel is 7 in any direction , if you have traveled 14 grids then are doing it wrong u appear on the opposite side of map if you go to edges , so it will alwatyys be only 7 grids travel no matter where u start or want to go 

 

 

There will always be bobs

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Well, to be honest, to travel 14 grids, you don't just have to travel in one direction.  What about going to a Power Stone, and then back to your base?  It's not like your ships are safe on just any old island.  So once you start the trip, you are basically committed.  This can take all day, when you consider getting there, finding the Hydra, defeating the Hydra, running the key to get the power stone, then sailing home.  And it's not like this is going to be smooth sailing in either direction.  This kind of a time commitment makes the game somewhat of a niche game...only for those who can play for long stretches...very long stretches.

I will be honest...if not for others doing the sailing to and from the power stone islands, I wouldn't have half of them.

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Yeh single player is easy in that respect cos you just leave the game and re-join where you left. You can't just abandon a voyage online cos you don't know what you'll be coming back to. I don't get why people who are against fast travel are against other people having it though. You wouldn't be forced to use it would you? Some people walk to work in the real world while others get a bus. I walk, but I don't shout and rant at the people on the bus cos they get there quicker, or for being lazier than me. Not everybody playing atlas has the luxury of being able to play for 9 hours a day.

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10 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

 

This is a problem with all survival games where raiding and wiping is a thing.  This is exactly why these games get a lot of interest when they are new, but the population dies very quickly.  The population dies, because people feel like they are spinning their wheels.  Farm, build, get raided, farm, rebuild, get raided, farm, rebuild, get wiped, farm rebuild, get raided, farm, rebuild get wiped...quit and move on to a new game.
 

From a PvP perspective, I suppose that's true.  From a PvE perspective, it's the devs that keep wiping you out so you have to rebuild.

Yes, it's EA.  Everybody expects there to be a lot of churn and expects a wipe might happen if there's no way around it.  But in previous EAs, betas, alphas, and other unfinished games, it has always seemed to me that a wipe would happen in order to enable some big new thing everyone was looking forward to, or fix some really rotten thing everyone hated.  Our first one here was to put in a new claim system nobody wanted, and our second was to fiddle around the edges with reconfiguring some of the islands and adding a few more.  Pretty disappointing reasons for wiping everything and everyone out, and the player base has shown their opinion of it by heading for the door.  That's from a PvE perspective.

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1 hour ago, Winter Thorne said:

From a PvP perspective, I suppose that's true.  From a PvE perspective, it's the devs that keep wiping you out so you have to rebuild.

Yes, it's EA.  Everybody expects there to be a lot of churn and expects a wipe might happen if there's no way around it.  But in previous EAs, betas, alphas, and other unfinished games, it has always seemed to me that a wipe would happen in order to enable some big new thing everyone was looking forward to, or fix some really rotten thing everyone hated.  Our first one here was to put in a new claim system nobody wanted, and our second was to fiddle around the edges with reconfiguring some of the islands and adding a few more.  Pretty disappointing reasons for wiping everything and everyone out, and the player base has shown their opinion of it by heading for the door.  That's from a PvE perspective.

I see your point, and agree, but I should have been more specific.  I see how my wording could be confusing.  I was actually referring to how you can get raided, and stuff popcorned, but your base remains intact, which is similar to a wipe, but much of your base is left standing.  Then at other times, you might get wiped.  To be honest, if your base is left standing but most of your stuff is gone, it can feel very much like a wipe.  You still know you are starting from scratch.  Many people are going to move to a new base, or island, at that point anyway, if they even stay with the game.  But, I was also trying to distinguish between the raids were you lose everything, and the raids where they wipe you to the point that there is no point in staying where you are.  Nobody really does a total foundation wipe anymore.  They take the island, and then use the game mechanics to wipe the entire island...normally.

This is why I highlighted that this is going to be much different in Star Citizen.  Chris Roberts has made statements, and we already know about the insurance for most things.  Since there will not be separate servers for PvE and PvP, they are not going to allow it to be a winner take all scenario, or they would have to have two Universes, which is not a good thing.  Frankly, this game, Atlas, would be better if so much focus wasn't on base defense.  On official, and some unofficials, I get horrible frame lag.  Why?  Huge amount of structures, and huge amount of NPCs for puckles, and huge amount of tames.

Seeing how this game is playing out, it makes me appreciate the differences that I am seeing in Star Citizen.

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11 hours ago, Captain Jack Shadow said:

Well, to be honest, to travel 14 grids, you don't just have to travel in one direction.  What about going to a Power Stone, and then back to your base?  It's not like your ships are safe on just any old island.  So once you start the trip, you are basically committed.  This can take all day, when you consider getting there, finding the Hydra, defeating the Hydra, running the key to get the power stone, then sailing home.  And it's not like this is going to be smooth sailing in either direction.  This kind of a time commitment makes the game somewhat of a niche game...only for those who can play for long stretches...very long stretches.

I will be honest...if not for others doing the sailing to and from the power stone islands, I wouldn't have half of them.

you make some good points.

my thoughts.

1. pve literally can stop at any island and chill. even most powerstone islands you can find a quiet beach to (relatively) safely anchor.

2. pvp. it was my impression that the fight and struggle to get to a powerstone on pvp was supposed to be this epic endgame battle for power. 

3. pve/pvp you can load a friends ship up with your favorite gear. anybody can then sail everybodies gear to the powerstone and then you can fast travel to the ship at will. 

4. i get the feeling people either dont know about the bed fast travel system or they just are not smart enough to figure out how to utilize it? i feel like im missing something...fast travel literally is already in the game, yet people keep crying for it?!!

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On 11/13/2019 at 10:11 PM, Gemini Five said:

There has to be a better way to get 14 grids without watching the water pass by for 2 hours. In the past you could watch tv or youtube while traveling. Now you risk your ship if you look away for 15 seconds.

The SOD are nothing but a pain now. I don't even have cannons unlocked yet and yet I can't sail a grid without dealing with them. They render leaving you seconds to react if in your path. Now. the whales! What happened with the whale? Is it birthing season. Their numbers seem to have just exploded recently. 

You know what sucks. You spends a few hours farming mats for a brig and a whale renders right in your path. You are full speed heading to it, it's aggroed on you coming at you full speed, you can't turn fast enough so you hit head on and come to a full stop. Hours of farming lost in 20 seconds. Boy that's fun! 

We really need some form of fast travel with your ship and goods. Face it, it's not like we have some booming trade market that's going to be unbalanced. I'm sure some may like to roleplay the long day at sea but I'm guessing most don't want to spend their free time watching the sea pass by dodging SOD and whales.

One downside I see about Atlas is that it is always making you spend time doing things you have no interest in doing, just to do the things you want to do. Like extended sea travel and low yield mat farming and now almost no xp for killing animals.

We need something like the Eve's warp gates. At least getting us to the general area we are headed. 

dont bother with all the intolerance you will find here i partially agree with you, winds and currents in this game are not implemented properly if you add to that the fact that the game has only 4 types of ships and Sotds loot is laughable you get a super boring sailing experience, yet if i was you i wouldnt expect a change any time soon.

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I agree that the winds and current system are in need of a balancing patch.  I don't want to see an instant fast-travel system though, I feel like doing anything like that would be way to exploitable in PvP and such.  I would like to see some sort of system with trade winds and ocean currents creating some sort of "highway" between sectors and across portions of the map.  Maybe ones that just give me a 50% speed bonus with a mild bumper system so I can sort of assisted-sail a bit at 30 knots instead of 15-20.

I don't think they need to be super log and perfectly symmetrical either, perhaps each one is like 3-4 sectors and they travel in all kinds of random directions.  So much so that I'd have to kind of pick and choose which ones I want to take to get to a destination, even if it means I end up traveling past the sector I'm aiming for and have to sail back a bit.

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if the currents acted like a slipstream where it set you on autopilot that might be cool.

im thinking like elite dangerous warp speed where you can still be interdicted but, mostly automated and relatively safe.

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Although I’m not too bothered about the long sail times, (sometimes I actually find it therapeutic and relaxing)

one thing that annoys me about the long sail times is safe harbour on PVP.

for example, if you’re unlucky with the wind one evening, you may have to ask permission and park up in someone’s island. Ideally one that’s just started peace phase.

its not fun when you come back on the following day and find several days of hard work was destroyed and looted an hour after you went to bed. This happens too often. Really limits your possible sail distance from home.

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Walking around the world on a ship is one of the main parts of the game content.

I don't know why a person who doesn't have the proper skills has the task of crossing half the world on a ship.

Moreover, I even assume that not on the ship, and on the trough 🙂

The schooner easily dodges enemy pve ships, as well as the Brigantine. The Galleon simply ignores them as it passes.

The speed of the ship, assembled from conventional parts, is about 18 knots, which makes it possible to cross the sector along the border in a few minutes

If the ship has a large load, the speed can drop by half, or more. But it is a captain's risk to sail on an overloaded ship.

If a person wants to fly in AFK, then he can go play EVE-online 🙂

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Actually airships were in the first version of atlas, and tbh I'd like them in the game, but not the ones they designed first rather more of a balloon and a ship style cabin underneath so you would have to steer with the wind. I don't care either way, but people using the argument against fast travel who quote this being a golden age  pyrate and sailing game is just plain wrong. Submarines, torpedoes, elevators, giant crabs, dragons etc, this is not a golden age pyrate or sailing game anymore.

Edited by Whitehawk

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On 11/14/2019 at 10:26 AM, Gemini Five said:

I understand that but I live in a polar zone. It is easy to out run a whale, but when the first sign of one is its health bar, that has already aggroed on you, right in front of you. Also as someone that lives on 15,  I'm now seeing a whole lot more whales now! I think there may be too many now but I don't hate whales and would not remove whales. Even as recent as a few weeks ago, you might sails many grids without seeing one. Not anymore. It's about the balance of danger. Some danger is good, too much becomes a nuisance.

Maybe don't live in a polar zone then? The meta (as I see it) is to start in a temperate or equatorial zone, them move toward the edges of the map to avoid the crowd after you have levels, alloys, and pastes to survive there until you have the capability of makings supply runs back toward the middle. Just because you found the perfect island before server wipe... doesn't mean it's perfect to start out on now. Just a thought.

As a relatively new player, but a seasoned ARK veteran, and a real life survivalist, I've always played these games in evolutions. Start somewhere easy, build a small thatch base, gather what you need for the next evolution. Then build a medium sized wood base, gathering what you need to move to a harsher environment with less traffic and visibility. Move there, repeat the thatch and wood bases while gathering what you need to upgrade to stone. Once you build a large stone base in that harsh environment, you establish supply routes, place defenses, expand... and eventually >boom< you're in contention for Alpha status (or at least getting the attention of Alpha tribes).

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20 hours ago, Dochollyhood said:

Maybe don't live in a polar zone then? The meta (as I see it) is to start in a temperate or equatorial zone, them move toward the edges of the map to avoid the crowd after you have levels, alloys, and pastes to survive there until you have the capability of makings supply runs back toward the middle. Just because you found the perfect island before server wipe... doesn't mean it's perfect to start out on now. Just a thought.

As a relatively new player, but a seasoned ARK veteran, and a real life survivalist, I've always played these games in evolutions. Start somewhere easy, build a small thatch base, gather what you need for the next evolution. Then build a medium sized wood base, gathering what you need to move to a harsher environment with less traffic and visibility. Move there, repeat the thatch and wood bases while gathering what you need to upgrade to stone. Once you build a large stone base in that harsh environment, you establish supply routes, place defenses, expand... and eventually >boom< you're in contention for Alpha status (or at least getting the attention of Alpha tribes).

I have about 2000 hours in. I've lived there a long time. I do understand the basic. That still does nothing for you when a whale renders right in your path when your at top speed and you can't turn to avoid. Resulting in an impact and a full stop, with the second strike takes out 4 planks. Then you get to the side of the whale to start moving again only to get the deathblow.

The post if poorly written is about 1. The time required to get somewhere while requiring continued full awareness just in case (boring). 2. Because you may have something render right in your path at close range.  Rendering range being the key issue, as it has always been.

It could be an easy fix. They could move the SOD and whales 300 meters off the grid border until they fix rendering range. So, those just wanting to get somewhere could travel the border and those wanting to hunt just go inward. That would also fix the problem of crossing a grid just to res/rending in the middle of an SOD fleet.

Edited by Gemini Five
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I wish I could find these whales I'm struggling but you guys are moaning saying there's too many and we live in polar 😢

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1 hour ago, Gemini Five said:

I have about 2000 hours in. I've lived there a long time. I do understand the basic. That still does nothing for you when a whale renders right in your path when your at top speed and you can't turn to avoid. Resulting in an impact and a full stop, with the second strike takes out 4 planks. Then you get to the side of the whale to start moving again only to get the deathblow.

The post if poorly written is about 1. The time required to get somewhere while requiring continued full awareness just in case (boring). 2. Because you may have something render right in your path at close range.  Rendering range being the key issue, as it has always been.

It could be an easy fix. They could move the SOD and whales 300 meters off the grid border until they fix rendering range. So, those just wanting to get somewhere could travel the border and those wanting to hunt just go inward. That would also fix the problem of crossing a grid just to res/rending in the middle of an SOD fleet.

Yeah... render distance is boned. I definitely agree there.

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21 hours ago, Atlaneer said:

I wish I could find these whales I'm struggling but you guys are moaning saying there's too many and we live in polar 😢

It's easy lately. Go down to the 15 line. Travel mid way between the grid border and the islands. Don't sail too fast. Keep turning your camera. Keeping looking backwards and to the sides. Almost everyone I see renders behind or to the side of me. The only one that has rendered in front of me, sank my brig. Watch for them breaking the surface, the spray cone or the green bar once they aggro. You should not need to go more than a few grids. Almost always one on the left mid of c15. But be warned, the big ones are pretty fast and can close on you quickly.

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On 11/20/2019 at 7:30 AM, Daigari said:

I don't know why a person who doesn't have the proper skills has the task of crossing half the world on a ship.

 

The skills are too limiting.  I fight on a bear, or tiger, so I need to be spec'd fully into beast mastery.  Why?  Why do I have to waste so many points for things I don't need?  We have tamers and breeders, but to fully exploit the tame's abilities, I have to fully spec into taming, breeding, etc...  I also need a personal combat skill.  Spec'ing into one or two takes a huge amount of points.  In the end, even at level 60, I just don't have enough to put into sailing.  Takes too many wasted points to get to the skills I need.  Not to mention that I have to waste points on vitamin depletion.

 

I wanted to hug the Star Citizen Dev during the Citizen Con demo.  The character wakes up, and goes to make some coffee.  They explained that you will have to eat and drink, but you won't have to do so every hour, like survival games make you do.  You aren't going to run out of water just because you sprinted, and you won't get hungry just because you mined some rocks.  It is simply going to add to immersion, not be something you have to constantly do.  It will just make the game feel more realistic.  You aren't going to suddenly start groaning, and then die if you don't get several steaks into your belly.

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On 11/21/2019 at 11:05 AM, Gemini Five said:

I have about 2000 hours in. I've lived there a long time. I do understand the basic. That still does nothing for you when a whale renders right in your path when your at top speed and you can't turn to avoid. Resulting in an impact and a full stop, with the second strike takes out 4 planks. Then you get to the side of the whale to start moving again only to get the deathblow.

The post if poorly written is about 1. The time required to get somewhere while requiring continued full awareness just in case (boring). 2. Because you may have something render right in your path at close range.  Rendering range being the key issue, as it has always been.

It could be an easy fix. They could move the SOD and whales 300 meters off the grid border until they fix rendering range. So, those just wanting to get somewhere could travel the border and those wanting to hunt just go inward. That would also fix the problem of crossing a grid just to res/rending in the middle of an SOD fleet.

 

On 11/21/2019 at 12:52 PM, Dochollyhood said:

Yeah... render distance is boned. I definitely agree there.

 

Many are not aware of this, but there is a slider for ship render distance.  Slide it all the way to the right.  Also, another setting to set view distance to epic.   It's not much, but it does give you a little bit more time to turn.

 

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trouble with a lotta mmo's devs find it easier to make the game grindier than to add content and make the game exciting to play. And yeh I agree about the skill tree, when I started a company I thought we'd all have different skills to offer, but no you all have to have basically the same which just seems daft. If a shipyard is company built then anyone should be able to build any ship on it if the skills have been bought already by an individual in the group, same as tames. alternatively they could give you the chance to open every skill line as an individual player. although there is discovery points atm.

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2 hours ago, Whitehawk said:

trouble with a lotta mmo's devs find it easier to make the game grindier than to add content and make the game exciting to play. And yeh I agree about the skill tree, when I started a company I thought we'd all have different skills to offer, but no you all have to have basically the same which just seems daft. If a shipyard is company built then anyone should be able to build any ship on it if the skills have been bought already by an individual in the group, same as tames. alternatively they could give you the chance to open every skill line as an individual player. although there is discovery points atm.

We could do different things, if they allowed us to choose what we want, and only spend points on what we want.  They literally have the worst skill tree I have ever seen in a game.  They should separate occupations, like tamer, breeder, farmer, cook, builder, ship builder, weapons crafter, armor crafter, in a different tree.  These are your occupations.  These are the things where people can specialize.  The other stuff is essential for everyone to have.  Riding, assorted fighting skills, captaineering, vitamins, gathering, etc...all need to be easier to get to.  We all need them.  I'm not saying you need all of the skills, such as every last fighting skill, but I am tired of having to choose between being able to fight with a tame, and being able to use a Sextant, or have fast turning sails, etc...  Really killing my enjoyment of the game.  They promised us that they were going to change the skill tree.  They haven't.  It needs a total rework.  People shouldn't be unable to fight when they are attacked, just because they had skill points into occupations they needed in order to be useful.  And they shouldn't have to sacrifice being useful, just to be ready to fight when attacked.  Then their idiotic solution is to make us go to a freeport to respec.  Yeah, I will just tell the enemy to take a smoke break for an hour, while I take the gold they want to steal, and go to the freeport to respec into fighting skills.  Yeah, I am sure they will accommodate me.  A game like this, they should let us create stat/skill profiles, and have potions on hand, like the alcohols, to respec with.  And don't make them decay.  Just let them be like the alcohol so you can make some, and have them on hand for when you get attacked, and need to respec into fighting.  Having profiles would be helpful so you can drink the potion, and then click a button, and be ready to fight the attackers.

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honestly, i agree and disagree with everything youre talking about. Fast travel aka teleportation should never be a thing in atlas... honestly i kinda have a problem with even bed spawning (i feel like spawning in after you die should have a much greater timer than 2 min) but when it comes to sailing, i believe if you want to find a new place you need to sail there manually. exploration is a huge aspect to this game... i mean shit... it's fun.. you get to see what others have built, find new pvp targets and you get discovery points... what's not to like about that... but when it comes to hauling materials... there really should be an automated sailing or trade winds (routes) that fallow grid walls. automated sailing being where you can put an npc on the steering wheel, hold e on the npc and select "select course" where it pops up a map where you can put in your turning points all the way to the eventual destination. there should be an option to make a special skill line or rank in companies called logistics managers that get notifications of all automated ships navigational progress or if its getting attacked by pirates.

benefits of such a system
1. More time doing what you actually love instead of spending all your time sailing resources around.
2. Pirate content - a constant supply of trader vessels to pillage and steal for your own company
3. Small companies now have a chance of finding and obtaining the materials it takes to build BP gear and stay competitive where before they didn't have the manpower and time to do the hauling manually. 
4. The chance to actually build a real economy. With the supplementation of materials and time allocation comes the building of BP's (supply and demand). where before you would just find worthless stacks of raw mats in the occasional mostly empty freeport store, now you will find premade BP's gear and parts. Gold will become more valuable and used. Int crafters will become renown and more coveted.

Edited by Enki Anunnaki
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The point on fast travel is that some people don't have the time to play for 8 hours a day, and you cant log off while you're sailing and log back in the same place, only in sp. so longer journeys are gonna be impossible for some people. And you need to sail a lot in this game and travel quite a distance especially for blueprints. They could have whirlpools as teleports that are strategically situated so that it wouldn't give too much of an advantage but enough to cut a journey in half. It cant be any worse than what people are using the beds for ie griefing other players, and no one want's them gone.

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7 hours ago, Whitehawk said:

you cant log off while you're sailing and log back in the same place

I have to assume that you are talking about PvP? Unless you are unwilling to take a 1 minute detour to the closest island so you can anchor, you should be able to do this anywhere in the world, Freeports and Golden Age ruins notwithstanding.

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