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[GP] Guybrush Threepwood

12 day holiday....

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So I went on a well deserved 12 day holiday, because you know Europe knows how to treat their employees.

This was my lovely solo build setup on official servers the day before I went on a 12 day holiday.

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This was my lovely solo build setup the day I returned from my 12 day holiday.

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This is what happened next...

IrBisVE.png

 

@Jatheish @Dollie I've said it time and time again, US employees may get treated like shit with their holiday entitlement, but other parts of the world get shown respect and rewarded with decent holiday entitlement.

10 days is absolutely atrocious for a game like this for solo players, or even for multiple players that may be a family that go on a family holiday, or a group of friends that go on a group holiday.

Everything I worked for and did all gone why? Because I chose to take time off from work and go on a well deserved holiday?

I really hope you for once deal with this issue. I know it's a difficult issue with spam structures etc, but don't ignore all the players outside of the US. Just because they get shit employers, don't punish the rest.

It's too late for me because I've decided to move on from ATLAS. But you really need to start appreciating that the majority of the world get decent holiday entitlement each year and it's unfair to lose everything because of it. Put it in your roadmap as a priority.

Thank you for the enjoyment, short-lived as it may be, but my ship has sailed.

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You are begging for mercy, and bragging about vacation at the same time. I don't dig this.

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Yeh I had Everything gone from a glitch after an update, didn't really want to quit so I now play single player and will go back to eu server at xbox launch. But tbh I really enjoy single player. And now it doesn't bother me at all that I lost everything. It's easy enough to re-build when I'm ready. Good luck to you, you never know you might be back again in the future.  

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Jats from the UK as far as i know so he kinda still is EU atleast for now 😛 but yeah Joke Aside that sucks 😞

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2 hours ago, [GP] Guybrush Threepwood said:

So I went on a well deserved 12 day holiday, because you know Europe knows how to treat their employees.

This was my lovely solo build setup on official servers the day before I went on a 12 day holiday.

NVVta1b.jpg

 

This was my lovely solo build setup the day I returned from my 12 day holiday.

JavE51e.jpg

 

This is what happened next...

IrBisVE.png

 

@Jatheish @Dollie I've said it time and time again, US employees may get treated like shit with their holiday entitlement, but other parts of the world get shown respect and rewarded with decent holiday entitlement.

10 days is absolutely atrocious for a game like this for solo players, or even for multiple players that may be a family that go on a family holiday, or a group of friends that go on a group holiday.

Everything I worked for and did all gone why? Because I chose to take time off from work and go on a well deserved holiday?

I really hope you for once deal with this issue. I know it's a difficult issue with spam structures etc, but don't ignore all the players outside of the US. Just because they get shit employers, don't punish the rest.

It's too late for me because I've decided to move on from ATLAS. But you really need to start appreciating that the majority of the world get decent holiday entitlement each year and it's unfair to lose everything because of it. Put it in your roadmap as a priority.

Thank you for the enjoyment, short-lived as it may be, but my ship has sailed.

Not saying anything bad gp. Because I ended up liking you. That is why you should would for the fire department. I get one day of sick and 2 days of vacation every month, so 3 days basically. To make things even better I work 4 days a week(which is awesome).

so basically if I used everything it would be 36 days that I accumulated. 9x4 is 36 so I basically get 2 mo this and 1 week off every year. Here is the kicker. We used to be able to pay an extra 4.5% of our check to get what we call voluntary paid leave or v-plp which gave us an extra day or with those extra 12 days that would put the total up to 3 months off every year. It was awesome. That was me just rooting my own horn for a minute. Now for the real response. 👇

dude that sucks man. I do give you props for your build though. I do like admiring other people’s work and that was a beauty. Sad to see you go now that I found out we at least somewhat get along. Even though I am playing borderlands 3 right now(which is awesome as hell) I just found out that Conan exiles is going jack to the one week timer instead of the two week timer they had. Now one of us has to log in at least once a week to make sure my pyramid of light doesn’t disappear. It might have only taken two weeks to build but after over 20 million or so resources, I am not going to let a timer ruin that

2 hours ago, Whitehawk said:

Yeh I had Everything gone from a glitch after an update, didn't really want to quit so I now play single player and will go back to eu server at xbox launch. But tbh I really enjoy single player. And now it doesn't bother me at all that I lost everything. It's easy enough to re-build when I'm ready. Good luck to you, you never know you might be back again in the future.  

Dude once you can finally let go it feels like freedom. Was like that on ark and then now Conan with my pyramid build. Not going to do that 💩 with atlas this go around. Won’t be wasting anytime.

if I go pvp and get wiped, I walk(yeah it will happen, wipes always happen).

if I go pve and a glitch makes everything disappear... done

no more hanging on to pixels. 

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I don't understand how someone can make a decision on a game like this to set  timers for buildings, ships, tamed animals...everything, that makes them disappear after such a small amount of time that people can't even go on vacation, or business trips, or become ill.  How does that happen?  They all sit around a table at a meeting or something and someone says that items are remaining in the world for too long and it's causing performance problems and trashing up the place.   And then with no concept of how a player actually experiences the game (advancing in building, shipmaking, taming over a period of months, maybe 2 or 3 hours/day, 4 or 5 days a week, and thinking, when this is done, I'm going to move on to discovery points, or advanced BPs, etc.), they decide that it's ok to wipe that stuff out if the player decides to take a few days off or sail around the world instead of rendering in all of their stuff every 10 days.  No discovery points or advanced BPs for you -  back to punching a tree and rebuilding it all for the next 4 months.

10 day timers are ridiculous for anything other than random small bits of building not found on a claim.  Players who have claimed land should be able to be confident that things on their claim remain long enough for them to conduct their lives without losing everything.

30 days is a reasonable amount of time to assume someone has quit playing the game.  15 days is a reasonable amount of time to assume some structure not on a claim was a temporary build.  There is no reason to have different timers for builds, ships, and animals.

If the mishmash of short timers seems necessary to  the devs to keep the servers clean at the current population level, then how do they anticipate doing that if the servers are fully populated?  3 days timers?  It makes no sense.

Another thing that makes no sense is this - 

10 hours ago, Realist said:

if I go pvp and get wiped, I walk(yeah it will happen, wipes always happen).

if I go pve and a glitch makes everything disappear... done

This is pretty rich coming from a person who has been demanding for months that all the existing players should suffer a complete wipe when he gets to start playing. "All your work must be erased for me, but if mine is ever erased, even by a valid game mechanic, I will quit."   It displays a level of un-self awareness and selfishness usually only found in toddlers.  Either that or it's one of the most sophisticated trolling jobs I've ever seen, where someone successfully creates a caricature of the most entitled self-centered person they can imagine, finds a profile photo to match, and plays the role to the hilt all over the forums.

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47 minutes ago, Winter Thorne said:

I don't understand how someone can make a decision on a game like this to set  timers for buildings, ships, tamed animals...everything, that makes them disappear after such a small amount of time that people can't even go on vacation, or business trips, or become ill.  How does that happen?  They all sit around a table at a meeting or something and someone says that items are remaining in the world for too long and it's causing performance problems and trashing up the place.   And then with no concept of how a player actually experiences the game (advancing in building, shipmaking, taming over a period of months, maybe 2 or 3 hours/day, 4 or 5 days a week, and thinking, when this is done, I'm going to move on to discovery points, or advanced BPs, etc.), they decide that it's ok to wipe that stuff out if the player decides to take a few days off or sail around the world instead of rendering in all of their stuff every 10 days.  No discovery points or advanced BPs for you -  back to punching a tree and rebuilding it all for the next 4 months.

10 day timers are ridiculous for anything other than random small bits of building not found on a claim.  Players who have claimed land should be able to be confident that things on their claim remain long enough for them to conduct their lives without losing everything.

30 days is a reasonable amount of time to assume someone has quit playing the game.  15 days is a reasonable amount of time to assume some structure not on a claim was a temporary build.  There is no reason to have different timers for builds, ships, and animals.

If the mishmash of short timers seems necessary to  the devs to keep the servers clean at the current population level, then how do they anticipate doing that if the servers are fully populated?  3 days timers?  It makes no sense.

Another thing that makes no sense is this - 

This is pretty rich coming from a person who has been demanding for months that all the existing players should suffer a complete wipe when he gets to start playing. "All your work must be erased for me, but if mine is ever erased, even by a valid game mechanic, I will quit."   It displays a level of un-self awareness and selfishness usually only found in toddlers.  Either that or it's one of the most sophisticated trolling jobs I've ever seen, where someone successfully creates a caricature of the most entitled self-centered person they can imagine, finds a profile photo to match, and plays the role to the hilt all over the forums.

How am I any different than the people that say they will quit if the wipe happens? To me I am just the same as everyone else really.

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Just now, Realist said:

How am I any different than the people that say they will quit if the wipe happens? To me I am just the same as everyone else really.

Based on that silly question, I'm now leaning toward option 2.

The answer, obviously, is because those people haven't been demanding that everyone else get wiped for the past 4 months.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Winter Thorne said:

Based on that silly question, I'm now leaning toward option 2.

The answer, obviously, is because those people haven't been demanding that everyone else get wiped for the past 4 months.

 

 

Well to be honest, a developer deciding to wipe and a glitch or player wiping you are two totally different things. Gp happened to be on vacation and lost everything. That is a lot different than the developers needing to wipe. Very big difference.

you getting offline and going to sleep and someone offline raiding you is also a different story.

those two ways are because of bad mechanics that make the game bad. The developers doing it is to make the game better.

if you notice I never said I would quit if the developers needed to wipe. And I wouldn’t. Everyone else would be getting wiped so it wouldn’t be a big deal and I would understand. So yeah very big differences.

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The Auto decay System is a two edged sword And will ever be. If you set the Timer to 7days People that Are on vacation And stuff will loose everything After those 7 days expire,while in the Other Hand if you set the Timer to 30 days it just Takes 24 hours for a landlord to be away for People to screw the Island or Build close to your base where you had already planned something And those People just Need to Login Once a month to keep the base Running. You can even make whole Islands or grids more or less Useless for everyone Else if such a Long Timer. I mean our base covers like 80% of the shore And also alot more into the Island,that stuff having a 30 Day Timer on it would mean we log in every 30 days for 1 Second And the Island will be overloaded with our base And no One could use it ever again as Long as we Pay the upkeep. If we Are Lucky And People coming to the Island we also Delay the upkeep Timer up to every 19 hours. So 160k Gold will Cover one Year upkeep. On a x2 Weekend And some map gathering beforehand  And playing Gold Song you can easlily get those 160k Gold on 1 Weekend 

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7 minutes ago, zottel said:

The Auto decay System is a two edged sword And will ever be. If you set the Timer to 7days People that Are on vacation And stuff will loose everything After those 7 days expire,while in the Other Hand if you set the Timer to 30 days it just Takes 24 hours for a landlord to be away for People to screw the Island or Build close to your base where you had already planned something And those People just Need to Login Once a month to keep the base Running. You can even make whole Islands or grids more or less Useless for everyone Else if such a Long Timer. I mean our base covers like 80% of the shore And also alot more into the Island,that stuff having a 30 Day Timer on it would mean we log in every 30 days for 1 Second And the Island will be overloaded with our base And no One could use it ever again as Long as we Pay the upkeep. If we Are Lucky And People coming to the Island we also Delay the upkeep Timer up to every 19 hours. So 160k Gold will Cover one Year upkeep. On a x2 Weekend And some map gathering beforehand  And playing Gold Song you can easlily get those 160k Gold on 1 Weekend 

Yeah, wasn't talking about claims and settling, which is a whole different subject.   IF they insist on keeping this faulty claim system, they need to do something entirely different about that issue apart from the regular inactive player timers.

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Building Without owning the Island or Building on lawless Will make it even easier to maintain structures with Login every now And then. Cant See Any proper Solution for this. Long Timer will benefit People Who Login once just to keep their base,but would help People on vacations. If they have a low Timer inactive companys And bases get removed faster  but also sucks if they are on a vacation.

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17 minutes ago, zottel said:

Building Without owning the Island or Building on lawless Will make it even easier to maintain structures with Login every now And then. Cant See Any proper Solution for this. Long Timer will benefit People Who Login once just to keep their base,but would help People on vacations. If they have a low Timer inactive companys And bases get removed faster  but also sucks if they are on a vacation.

There is a solution. All you have to do is answer one question and the answer will appear.

”what is more important, punishing bad people, or helping good people?”

the answer to that question is the solution.

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1 hour ago, Realist said:

There is a solution. All you have to do is answer one question and the answer will appear.

”what is more important, punishing bad people, or helping good people?”

the answer to that question is the solution.

Its not really that easy as you also punish the Good People By the behavior of the Bad ones. We had a Couple that Used to Breed for us And were gone for a Weekend And After they came back they literally had no Space anymore on their own Island. They made a Second base on an allys base And even After 2 And a half months they still could Not build a thing because those People kept refreshing the Timer.

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22 minutes ago, zottel said:

Its not really that easy as you also punish the Good People By the behavior of the Bad ones. We had a Couple that Used to Breed for us And were gone for a Weekend And After they came back they literally had no Space anymore on their own Island. They made a Second base on an allys base And even After 2 And a half months they still could Not build a thing because those People kept refreshing the Timer.

You're right. Describing it as "good people and bad people" is way oversimplified, and that question has very little to do with anything.  A long timer benefits the people on vacation and people who only log in occasionally.  It hurts new players who will have a harder time finding space.   There's no sense in calling any of those people good or bad.  It's just a matter of trying to be fair to all of them, finding a balance, and creating enough assets in the game so there's enough for all the active players.

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There is a solution, one the dev's have even suggested, but maybe not in this context.

An upkeep chest for buildings / connected structures.

structures will keep a decay timer with or without this item attached, but short say 8 days or so. you can put mats into the chest to increase the duration up to say 30 days. Here's the good bit, the chest will consume any mats inside first before defaulting to the 8 day timer, so no upkeep cost if you play on a weekly basis but you can prepare for a trip or vacation.

The down side is if you have multiple disconnected structures at your base you'll need multiple upkeep chests.

 

I think I put this idea in the suggestions thread about 4-6 months ago.

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5 minutes ago, Jack Shandy said:

There is a solution, one the dev's have even suggested, but maybe not in this context.

An upkeep chest for buildings / connected structures.

structures will keep a decay timer with or without this item attached, but short say 8 days or so. you can put mats into the chest to increase the duration up to say 30 days. Here's the good bit, the chest will consume any mats inside first before defaulting to the 8 day timer, so no upkeep cost if you play on a weekly basis but you can prepare for a trip or vacation.

The down side is if you have multiple disconnected structures at your base you'll need multiple upkeep chests.

 

I think I put this idea in the suggestions thread about 4-6 months ago.

I hope that's only for things not on your own claim.  There's no reason to charge upkepp like that for buildings you put on claimed land.

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9 minutes ago, Winter Thorne said:

I hope that's only for things not on your own claim.  There's no reason to charge upkepp like that for buildings you put on claimed land.

Claims are already on a cost timer - the flag. you could have the short timer start on your buildings within a claim, if it runs out of money.

By the way I'm not a Dev or programmer just a bloke chucking out an idea, don't bash it just because you see an issue with it, offer options, alterations or if none spring to mind just point out the issue you see.

 

Edited by Jack Shandy

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While i wouldnt mind more upkeep it adds extra Grind for Smaller companys.And if it only Starts the Timer for the owner when it Runs out of Gold we are back to were People can keep it up for years.it is just to find a Decent Balance between too fast or too Long Timers. Only Other Option would be to let People have the options to Set their stuff into stasis for like 14 days once a Year but even then you have the Problem if you go on a vacation And your Second member is ill you Used the stasis for one member And the others are screwed kinda. 

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4 hours ago, Winter Thorne said:

You're right. Describing it as "good people and bad people" is way oversimplified, and that question has very little to do with anything.  A long timer benefits the people on vacation and people who only log in occasionally.  It hurts new players who will have a harder time finding space.   There's no sense in calling any of those people good or bad.  It's just a matter of trying to be fair to all of them, finding a balance, and creating enough assets in the game so there's enough for all the active players.

That is why my idea for continents would be good. There is plenty of water. With 225 grids per cluster even having 10 grids all land wouldn’t hurt the sailing. Hell even 30 wouldn’t put a dent in the ocean.

not just that but as far as resetting the timer goes they can make it to where someone has to be longed in for an hour in order for the timers to reset. If they are willing to spend that much time and effort then screw it they deserve to keep it. The timer length should be about 15 days. It allows for a 2 week vacation and one day to get back and get on.

make the inactives work harder to reset the timer and that would distinguish the actives from in actives

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2 hours ago, Jack Shandy said:

Claims are already on a cost timer - the flag. you could have the short timer start on your buildings within a claim, if it runs out of money.

By the way I'm not a Dev or programmer just a bloke chucking out an idea, don't bash it just because you see an issue with it, offer options, alterations or if none spring to mind just point out the issue you see.

 

I'm not bashing the idea.  I think upkeep is fine for non-claimed land.    Buildings on claims are already controlled by the flag, as you pointed out.  But if we had a sensible claim system, structures on claimed land wouldn't need any form of upkeep at all.  If a person could only have one claim, and everyone could have a claim, then you don't need upkeep to tell when they've abandoned the game.  The game itself knows how long since a player has logged in and the timer can just be set against that.

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Having only one claim per Person would Totally be okay or 1 Island per Company. But everyone having an own claim, provided we get a bigger playerbase at some Point, is something i Totally Dislike. Hated or loved but the claim System And landlord And tennants is a thing unique as also a core mechanic in the Game Which i really like despite that bigger companys can still claim more islands. Also would like continents in some form atleast,more like a designated area of Peace And trading that also Limits the Space allowed to Build on depending on the Business And Amount of Members a Company has. While Storing 10k BPs only Need a small Place a player Selling tames Need a Big Place. Just Need to make it unexploidable

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Wurm Online has had to deal with this issue for many years now and they have solved it as far as I am concerned.  

Infact Wurm Onlines land claim system and how it protects said land is leaps and bounds better than atlas in every way!

The Token, the land claim device that holds your upkeep and sets the rules for who can do what inside of said property as well as being the primary point you need to defend from raiders who wish to steal its upkeep money is honestly the answer to Atlas's problems!

As long as the Token has upkeep it will protect and fend off decay of items inside of its area!

Upkeep is dependant on the size of the area that is being claimed.

I still have over a years upkeep on my token in Wurm Online I don't have to log in tomorrow or a week from now to know everything I have done there is still okay.

(True I could have been raided!  In which case 25% of my upkeep was taken and my token cannot be raided again for the period of "X" amount of time depending on value that was taken)

So for my situation my years upkeep gets taken now I only have 9 months of upkeep which cannot again be raided for 3 Months in three months if I don't log on someone will likely easily walk up to my token as whoever broke thru all my walls to get to it has cleared the path to it the first time....at this point there is 6 Months of upkeep left and they will acquire 25% of what's remaining meaning my upkeep after this second raid will be 4.5 Months since the value that was stolen is less the protection time from being raided drops to 1.5 months...  So the token will be open to be stolen from again when there is 3 Months of upkeep left....  

 

So one can get a very long period of safety bye maintaining a lot of upkeep money on the token at the same time if that token is actually raided the raiders are walking away with 25% of a very large sum which makes them very happy....  

And while it sucks that you got raided you know have a very large grace window where you do not have to worry about being raided again....

 

Of course many people choose to maintain smaller amounts of money on there token and that is how they choose to play...

But to summarize to can easily go on vacation and know your land and buildings etc and most of  your upkeep will still be there!

Of course many valuables in Wurm are simply Items like a high quality sword that you left in a chest in the corner of your room, that likely won't be there when you get back, but the Forge and Anvil and tools to make a new one will be there!!!  

Anyway I will stop rambling on, and summarize other games in this example Wurm Online. Have dealt with the same types of issues and they do a far better job then Atlas does in dealing with them....

 

 

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3 months raid protection if I get my friends company to raid me?

Can't see a problem with that.

Also, no longer a full loot game?

Nice.

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24 minutes ago, eeeceee said:

3 months raid protection if I get my friends company to raid me?

Can't see a problem with that.

Also, no longer a full loot game?

Nice.

Almost any mechanism you can come up with, someone with enough time, friends and resources can find a way to exploit it. Given that the devs are already supposedly considering making land structures indestructible as a means to shift pvp focus onto the water where it belongs, I don’t see the loophole you bring up being too big of a deal.

On the other hand I think there is much to recommend the idea. Claims have proven to be one of Atlas's thorniest problems to date. If Wurm has developed a solution that works and that solution has been in place long enough to be proven, then there’s no need to reinvent the wheel. The main question would be: Is there any appreciable difference between the two games that would impact whether this approach could work for Atlas?

Off the top of my head I can’t think of anything and that makes me a fan of this suggestion. I think this is something that @Jatheish and company should have a look at if they haven’t already.

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